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Governments that forbid play at accredited casinos

nikantw

nikantw

Closed Account
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Location
EU
Latest news from VS rep:

"We recently got contacted by the Australian government and they requested us to make sure no players are able to play while being in Australia."

WTF!

Governments do get out of their way to make sure you can only play at rogue casinos, don't they?
And things will get worst....

I say those are rogue governments. This thread is not only about Australia, it is for all that do things like that. For our "protection" as they dare to say.
 
Can someone please start a change.org petition against the Australian governments harsh move.
This is just not right. Australia is NOT the lucky country it used to be when we have wanna be dictators at the helm. Turnbull is an elitist wanker that has no idea how real people want to enjoy spending their worked for cash. Who tells him what he can and cannot afford.
Okay censor the welfare recipients somehow but leave others alone to enjoy what they enjoy. He's just a greedy bastard, yet allows Bishop to give away all this foreign aid to anyone who asks for it and we can't look after our own homeless, elderly and less fortunate.
Don't get me started on climate change and how much supposedly goes to that.
 
As mentioned a number of times here, the Australia government is taking steps to contact both casinos AND affiliates by telling them that they are violating their regs. Ill thought out and it does NOTHING at all to protect ANY gambler. Gamblers will always gamble, and now they are heading over to nefarious operators like these rogues.

These crap holes are the ones that are profiting, and gamblers have no protections whatsoever. Rogue casinos like these prey on the problem and compulsive gambler. There is no safety-net for gamblers who have self excluded elsewhere. Check out casinos like Bronze Casinos that admit that they accept problem gamblers. The Australian goverment folks need to face reality and stop being so protectionistic.
 
azzagirt said:
Can someone please start a change.org petition against the Australian governments harsh move.
This is just not right. Australia is NOT the lucky country it used to be when we have wanna be dictators at the helm. Turnbull is an elitist wanker that has no idea how real people want to enjoy spending their worked for cash. Who tells him what he can and cannot afford.
Okay censor the welfare recipients somehow but leave others alone to enjoy what they enjoy. He's just a greedy bastard, yet allows Bishop to give away all this foreign aid to anyone who asks for it and we can't look after our own homeless, elderly and less fortunate.
Don't get me started on climate change and how much supposedly goes to that.
Click to expand...

We should write to the paper or like you suggested have a petition we like to have a play on slots especially after work it relaxes some people and we as people should be able to choose how and what we can spend our money on.

The money that we work for!!
 
@nikantw I may have misunderstood this but if the local laws do not allow online gambling then you are obliged to abide by local laws. For example this means that a UK citizen shouldn't be doing online gambling if they were physically located in Australia (assuming online gambling is banned in Oz).

Is your complaint that Australians should be allowed to gamble online or that non-Australians should be allowed to gamble online when in Australia?
 
For info, Dan has posted the following this morning:

"Due to their request we made some updates to our IP controller, to make sure no traffic from Australian IP's can deposit or play with us. You will still be able to withdraw from an Australian IP.
Your account will remain open and you will be able to continue to play when you login from another location.

We are sorry for the inconvenience."
 
slotter999 said:
@nikantw I may have misunderstood this but if the local laws do not allow online gambling then you are obliged to abide by local laws. For example this means that a UK citizen shouldn't be doing online gambling if they were physically located in Australia (assuming online gambling is banned in Oz).

Is your complaint that Australians should be allowed to gamble online or that non-Australians should be allowed to gamble online when in Australia?
Click to expand...

I may be second guessing @nikantw here, but I believe he could be referring to any country that bans online gambling.

However, Australia does NOT ban online gambling for us Aussies. It is not illegal.

What is illegal, and what our wonderful government has banned, are online casinos offering their services to us without a licence.

And absolutely no mechanism exists to allow any casino to apply for an online licence.

Catch-22. We can play. But there is nowhere to play.

As C3PO once said...."Nous sommes perdu."
 
@ladyhawke Thank you for the clarification. That is indeed a very strange situation. I'm guessing what was happening pre this change was non-Australian citizens were being allowed to gamble while being physically located in Australia which sounds like it was flouting the law.
 
Supababe said:
For info, Dan has posted the following this morning:

"Due to their request we made some updates to our IP controller, to make sure no traffic from Australian IP's can deposit or play with us. You will still be able to withdraw from an Australian IP.
Your account will remain open and you will be able to continue to play when you login from another location.

We are sorry for the inconvenience."
Click to expand...

That is why I moved to Germany ;)
 
slotter999 said:
@nikantw I may have misunderstood this but if the local laws do not allow online gambling then you are obliged to abide by local laws. For example this means that a UK citizen shouldn't be doing online gambling if they were physically located in Australia (assuming online gambling is banned in Oz).

Is your complaint that Australians should be allowed to gamble online or that non-Australians should be allowed to gamble online when in Australia?
Click to expand...

It's a complaint against all governments that act against public interest.

We have to obey the law, but we also have to challenge the law when it is against the constitution, against the public interest.
Gambling should be regulated, but people are best protected when they play at accredited casinos, there is no argument about that.

So any government that doesn't let you play at accredited casinos clearly doesn't care about you. They don't serve you, they serve other interests.

Am I being harsh? I don't think so. I am not talking about cases of a complete 100% ban on any gambling form, or about a regulatory overkill like UK.
I am talking about countries that find "clever tricks" to essentially ban accredited casinos but let others that are practically robbing you with TRTP as low as 50%.
 

Not being harsh at all and absolutely right, beautiful country and the worst government, me and halibaker going to ban the government :lolup:
 
Dan (VS) has pretty much spelt it out, without actually say it.

Australian accounts can remain open and they can withdraw to an Australian IP.

He has said, they just cannot play from an Australian IP.

Obviously he cannot say use a VPN to play, But more importantly he has not said you can't.
 
I have no clue how things are run in Australia but it seems to me that banning online gambling only helps Australian landbased casinos. So the Government saying that they are trying to protect their citizens smacks of BS to me. They could go down the route of many European countries and tax it so that the people can benefit. Seems stupid to me to ban a lucrative tax revenue base. If they are doing this to protect Aussies then they should ban gambling across the board both online and land based. So banning the online gambling with the reasons that they have given is an insult to the Australian peoples intelligence in my opinion.
 
nikantw said:
...So any government that doesn't let you play at accredited casinos clearly doesn't care about you. They don't serve you, they serve other interests.

Am I being harsh? I don't think so. I am not talking about cases of a complete 100% ban on any gambling form, or about a regulatory overkill like UK.
I am talking about countries that find "clever tricks" to essentially ban accredited casinos but let others that are practically robbing you with TRTP as low as 50%.
Click to expand...

The term 'accredited' is purely a Casinomeister term, and has no significance - legal or advisory - outside of Casinomeister.

The Aussie govt is not interested in whether a casino is accredited, rogue or whatever. It is trying to deny all Australians the right to spend their own money in any way they choose, in effect pandering to the (minority) anti-gambling lobby, and ignoring the rest of us without even the courtesy of a consultation.

I'm not entirely sure what measures they can enforce against casinos who refuse to comply, as online casinos are outside of Australia's jurisdiction, but not all those casinos are rogue, and for those (non rogue) ones who are sticking with us, I am very grateful.

What are our alternatives?

CM mentions sports betting. I am simply not interested. I like the flashing lights, and the music, and the graphics of slots, as well as the thrill of a potential big win. I can think of nothing more boring than trying to predict sports results, although I did the Pools years ago. Also, to me sports betting borders on hardcore gambling - gambling for gambling's sake. IMHO of course. But more importantly, I love watching certain sports, and I certainly don't want to degrade that experience by bringing sports betting into the equation.

Casinos - none where I live (regional Australia), although the Gold Coast is not that far away.

RSL Clubs: 4 large RSL clubs with numerous pokies within a 10k radius. And about 3 others within a 30k radius. Problem is - the RTP. Also on my last visit to my local RSL, most of the pokies seem to be linked jackpots, which I don't really like. I much prefer stand-alone pokies.

Other clubs: bowling. golf, etc. About 15 near here within a 30k radius. Limited number of pokies in each but having very low RTP.

And all these clubs are packed from opening to closing time. So if the govt is trying to ban online gaming for our health, or wealth, or whatever, they are way off the mark.

If the govt can tax the land-based pokies and casinos, why can't they do that for online?

Because there is a very, very strong anti-online gambling lobby in Australia, and the govt is simply too weak to defy them. So it takes the path of least resistance, and simply rolls over.

Can't the govt see the hypocrisy in its actions? Land-based casinos and clubs can destroy health and wealth as easily as online casinos but they don't seem to perceive these as a threat.
 
Look what the US managed to do to players. Some states have legalized stuff, but not when it first happened.

Quebec (a province in Canada), tried to prohibit all play other than the government site, and have ISPs ban it, but that was struck down by the CRTC (Canadian Radio and Telecommunication Commission).

Casino owners can be arrested if they come on US soil offering "illegal" services.

It's off the top of my head, but doesn't Italy's licenced casinos only pay 75% back to players?

When I was in Belgium briefly, I couldn't play at my favourite casinos, as they did not hold a licence for Belgium. I could in Malta or the Netherlands, as they held the proper licences.

IMO governments don't care that much if you gamble, they just want to make sure they are the ones making money off it.

But if you don't offer the punters a legal choice, they will take "illegal" choices.

If you are going to make a choice of casino that takes players without a proper licence in your country, I'd pick one from the CM accredited list frankly. Which mostly leaves RTG, which does have lower RTPs for the largest part.

As a Canadian, I have a lot of game restrictions, and not every casino welcomes us. But it is not illegal for me to gamble offshore.

Yet.
 
I urge anyone to refrain from informative posts like the one from Gaz237 (no offense please). It just helps investigators to find people and casinos who are trying to circumvent the laws/restrictions. When you search for gambling related stuff, CM is very often on page 1 and hence, somebody sniffing around here could easily find the information the government is looking for and to get into action for installing even more barriers. D's post was the perfect example how to formulate a hidden hint. :)

Just my two cents.
 
Jasminebed said:
IMO governments don't care that much if you gamble, they just want to make sure they are the ones making money off it.
Click to expand...

This.
It's nothing to do with the population's wellness - if that were ever a concern then they wouldn't profit from smokes, booze and land based casinos.
It's an enormous conflict of interest, the government is run by businesses at the expense of the public.
 
mina1929 said:
Like Harry said, I was actually thinking the same thing we don't want the snoopers and certainly no more barriers :)

lets talk some of the topics via private chat, safer ;)
Click to expand...

This suggestion sounds good - in theory.

However, by limiting any discussion re Australian gambling to private chats, you are excluding everyone who is not privy to that chat, which will mean any player (CM member or lurker) who wants to learn more about where we can play, and more. In effect, you will be creating a two-tier level of discussion - blocked to everyone except the privileged few invited to the private chat.

Of course, as both you and @Harry_BKK have stated, open discussions can lead to too much information being shared with those pesky unwanted investigators.

So to overcome that, would not the ideal solution be to have a section similar to America the Brave? Still restrictive, but eventually will have a far wider audience than just private chats?
 

Yeah it makes it really hard either way and just want to be careful, I usually just pm members if I need to find out more detailed info :)
 
Australia’s economy is and probably always will be been built on outrageous cronyism and monopolies, its just been slow on the uptake keeping up with technological advances like internet gambling.

Like other posts here confirm, its NOTHING to do with the anti-gambling lobbies - the Aussie government couldn't give two shits about that - and everything to do with keeping profits up for the B&M owners and their mates in government. Their alcohol industry is kept running along the same lines, same as their banking industry. Small time views run by close knit families, much like Vegas was run in the 70s.

I hope VS told the government official where to go - cheeky f***ers.
 
Steviedoo said:
what will the Australian government do to casinos that accept Australian players? And to Australian players who gamble online?
Click to expand...
From what I heard when all this started , was their funds were to be returned to where it came from. The banks were told not to allow the money even to hit peoples accounts. Canada is so connected with Aussie laws, I wouldnt be surprised if they were taking a look at how things play out on their side.
 

That is not entirely true.

In 2016, Australians lost more money per person than any other developed nation.

Apparently there are over 196k pokies in Australia, and where there are pokies, incidents of social problems, such as domestic violence, are far higher than those areas where pokies are fewer.

Gambling is prolific among disadvantaged aussies, and there is widespread dismay that many indigenous aussies are spending their benefits on gambling and alcohol, and not on the necessities of life (food, rent, etc).

It is these factors that anti-gambling lobbies are highlighting, and which are behind their attempts to ban gambling, both onshore and offshore.

But...perhaps the anti-gambling crusade, of which the govt advocates it is a firm believer, may simply be a smokescreen after all.

Because the crux of the matter seems to be...preventing any restriction to onshore gambling "is a powerful gambling industry, and their cozy relations with the government."

If this is the case, it is despicable, and certainly appears the govt is playing with a double-edged sword: Ban offshore to appease the anti-gambling lobby which also benefits the Aussie gambling industry, by removing the offshore competition.

One further point: CM mentioned in an earlier post that online sports betting is legal. However this type of betting is apparently causing a major gambling problem among young men, so why is it legal, and not online casinos? Beggars belief, IMHO.

I agree with your sentiment re VS. However, they have also rolled over as they are not accepting any new players from Australia.

Steviedoo said:
what will the Australian government do to casinos that accept Australian players? And to Australian players who gamble online?
Click to expand...

It is not illegal for aussies to gamble online at any offshore casino, so there are no penalties involved - it is just illegal for offshore casinos to offer their services to us Aussies.

However, I would also love to know what the govt can do to those offshore casinos that still allow us to play, as those are outside of the govt's jurisdiction.
 
bebo67 said:
From what I heard when all this started , was their funds were to be returned to where it came from. The banks were told not to allow the money even to hit peoples accounts. Canada is so connected with Aussie laws, I wouldnt be surprised if they were taking a look at how things play out on their side.
Click to expand...

Bebo, I don't think this is accurate. Some banks are certainly preventing use of credit/debit cards for deposits, which would possibly also affect withdrawals. However other major banks do not have these restrictions.

Of course, in time this may all change, to the detriment of us all over here.
 


We should not stop discussing and exchanging info but a slight attempt to hide the hints as Dan did it in his post would make it less obvious. There's no need to spill the beans in full display. :D

Just my suggestion, everyone can of course post how they like or see fit.
 
ladyhawke said:
Bebo, I don't think this is accurate. Some banks are certainly preventing use of credit/debit cards for deposits, which would possibly also affect withdrawals. However other major banks do not have these restrictions.

Of course, in time this may all change, to the detriment of us all over here.
Click to expand...
It was in an article that I read some time ago. Banks were not allowed to process incoming casino monies. It's late here in Canada right now, but tomorrow I will look for it :)
 
I just did a quick Google, and all the money laundering that comes up for Australia. Some articles dated back as far as 2011. So that seems to be a problem from the get go?
 
TheresNoDInBonanza said:
This.
It's nothing to do with the population's wellness - if that were ever a concern then they wouldn't profit from smokes, booze and land based casinos.
It's an enormous conflict of interest, the government is run by businesses at the expense of the public.
Click to expand...
I think somewhat along the same lines whenever I read stories about people calling for a ban on this and that. History has shown us that bans don't work as people will find a way. Look at how well prohibition worked out for the government in the US in the 30's. All that prohibition created was a bunch of criminals and people still found a way to drink. Just an example.

If the Australian government was so worried about it's citizens gambling then it would ban all casinos, online and land based.The fact that they chose to ban the online ones proves that they are only concerned with the people who own the land based casinos and their profits. But hey what do I know?
 
In Belgium there's only a handful of operators that have a license from the Belgian Gaming Commission. None of the big dogs like VS are active here, they don't accept Belgian customers. The catch is that online casino's that want to get a license need to be affilliated with a brick & mortar casino. There's only 4 online casino's out of 9 which are internationally known: Unibet, bwin, Ladbrokes and Betway. As most of you know those are all big sportsbooks too. The other 5 casino's are all local brands.

Anyway, even with the smaller amount of casino's available we can still play most of the providers and games with only a few missing like Gamomat. The other downside is that gamereleases can be really late compared to the big international casino's.

On the upside: there's very little stories of casino's not paying the customer since it's all very heavily regulated and with them being affilliated with landbased casino's you can actually go to the casino and complain. Some even offer you to get your withdrawals at their casino.
 
Harry_BKK said:
I urge anyone to refrain from informative posts like the one from Gaz237 (no offense please). It just helps investigators to find people and casinos who are trying to circumvent the laws/restrictions. When you search for gambling related stuff, CM is very often on page 1 and hence, somebody sniffing around here could easily find the information the government is looking for and to get into action for installing even more barriers. D's post was the perfect example how to formulate a hidden hint. :)

Just my two cents.
Click to expand...

Point taken,

To late to edit.
 


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