ATTN: Casino Rep Accidental Max Bet Hell at 21Casino

[ChopleyIOM]

So I did 'it' today and placed a max bet by accident, my first time ever, and it was a doozy!

£125 (!!!) gone at the press of a button on a slot called Trip Trap Troll at 21Casino. I was looking around providers I hadn't tried before and loaded this game in (so I wasn't familiar with the interface), if I'm entirely honest I don't quite know how I managed to do it, part of the problem is that the bet level 'rolls over', so if you click on the 'decrease bet' button to the minimum bet level of 25p, and then click the same button again, it then changes the bet to £125, and I think that's what I must have done.

I immediately opened up a Live Chat and the person I got was polite and helpful, and understood the problem, but apologetically informed me that all bets are final with no chance of a review or refund.

As you know I'm a low-roller, the biggest bets I've done at 21Casino were (IIRC) £1 when I was on the SUB, and since then I've only done minimum bets or up one level from minimum bets, so between 20p and 40p. As such the £125 spin is clearly a horrible mistake, but no joy on it being refunded. And yes I completely understand the counter-argument of 'Well what would you have done if you had landed a win? Given it back?'

So yes it's my fault and I should have been more careful, but still, ouch.

Just to show you what I mean, if you click on this button here down to the minimum bet level of 25p:

And then you click on the same button one more time, this happens:

And I did indeed press spin and made a £125 spin.

The 25p spin I did afterwards was my 'what the fuck did I just do?' moment......

More info on this casino can be found in their review

 

[johnnymcc1966]

This is one of the things UKGC should be looking at instead of a lot of other trivial matters they seem to focus on. Credit to some casinos where games load at minimum stake level but many never do this. Its been a bugbear of mine for a while because it can not only drain your balance in one spin but gives the casino an excuse when you are on bonus money to void any pay out.

 

[Bloatgoat]

I had the same a while ago. I auto-played a game on 20 euro a spin rather then the 2 euro i thought i was doing. Cash vanished in less then a minute lol. When i contacted support they gave me the "it's your responsibility" answer. So pay a bit more attention the next time.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Yeah I'm not blaming anyone other than myself, I should have been more careful. The thing is I have loads of stuff open on my PC at once and was actually playing a game of Hearthstone at the same time too. Normally I get away with this perfectly well because I tend to play games I'm familiar with and pretty much get the bet level/autoplay/stop triggers set up on auto pilot.

Where this falls down of course is when you're loading a slot in from a provider you've never played before, which also has the 'gotcha' that the decrease bet button also functions as a MAX BET button if you press it one more time when you're at minimum bet.

I've loaded in slots from some other providers I've been playing recently, and none of them work that way, i.e. you can't 'overpress' the decrease bet button and then find yourself doing a £125 spin......

 

[Kroffe]

Ive never managed to bet that high, but ive also made a couple big bets by mistake.
I like spinning on spacebar when playing manually, and Microgaming for some reason had the great idea that pressing spacebar means the person wants to change to maxbet.
Demolished my small deposit pretty quick.

But its a tricky situation, because as you said, what if you had hit something.

Ive seen people get refunded for mistakes like this, but its usually when a bonus is involved and a win wouldnt have counted anyway.

 

[Siohmy]

Ah yes, brings back memories of me doing the same thing albeit slightly differently for pretty much exactly the same max bet. Can’t remember the slot and I think it was Energy casino from memory (there is a post somewhere on the forum).

I do think it’s pretty poor to continually have the max bet right next to the start. I accidentally double clicked and was fractionally over the max bet on the first click. Unlikely? Sure. Impossible? Not at all. And to have that bet run to over £100 is inexcusable.

 

[irish-ranger]

This happened to @Playford7 on all British jan sorted it but he did state something along the lines that it’s not something they generally do giving refunds involving new players especially as they have zero game history.

 

[Siohmy]

Just to add, and balance my post somewhat, most slots these days default at £2, many retain your previous play level and most have avoided the Max Bet next door to the start. A looping bet size however is pretty bad!

 

[ChopleyIOM]

A looping bet size however is pretty bad!

Yes trying to 'retrace my steps' as it were I'm now quite sure that's what happened, it's totally my own fault for pressing SPIN on a £125 bet size, but I also think it's crap design that the button that has a primary function of DECREASE BET, also functions as INCREASE MY BET SIZE BY 5000% if you press it one more time when already at minimum bet - turning 25p into £125........

 

[ChopleyIOM]

This happened to @Playford7 on all British jan sorted it but he did state something along the lines that it’s not something they generally do giving refunds involving new players especially as they have zero game history.

In fairness I'm not a new player at 21Casino now, I've made several deposits and withdrawals, and they'll have tens of thousands of spins on record for me.

IIRC I went up to £1 spins on the SUB due to it being quite a large SUB with a fairly hefty WR.

Since then I've made my usual straight £100 deposits and all my bets have been between 20p and 40p (maybe up to 50p?), so the £125 bet is clearly a terrible mistake and entirely unintentional.

I totally get that I'm not entitled to anything here, and I accept that the mistake was mine, but I maintain it's a really shitty bit of UI design!

 

[Playford7]

In fairness I'm not a new player at 21Casino now, I've made several deposits and withdrawals, and they'll have tens of thousands of spins on record for me.

IIRC I went up to £1 spins on the SUB due to it being quite a large SUB with a fairly hefty WR.

Since then I've made my usual straight £100 deposits and all my bets have been between 20p and 40p (maybe up to 50p?), so the £125 bet is clearly a terrible mistake and entirely unintentional.

I totally get that I'm not entitled to anything here, and I accept that the mistake was mine, but I maintain it's a really shitty bit of UI design!

In all honesty I was given a pass as a member here and my bet history showed I never went anywhere near the accidental bet I placed ever in the history of me playing at the casino.

it was clear to see it was a error, I agree with you regarding ‘what if it hit’ but it didn’t..

I’d certainly ask the rep on here however as it’s a lot of money to lose on one spin yoU would never place anyhow judging by your bet history over the years.

anyone whom watches you here as I do will be aware those kind of stakes are not even in the realms of reality for you, contact the rep.

I would, It’s a blatant error and shitty interface that caused you to do that.

 

[dunover]

Ouch!! Beat my £40 on MG's Isis slot when I first started online gambling years ago. Like you and everyone else who has accidentally done this, I got a dead spin. Funny, that.....

 

[Buffalo Bill]

I once did this on rainbow riches years ago, max bet was £400, after 2 spins the not enough balance to place bet message popped up and my heart dropped out of my arse.
Never occurred to me to complain, but I wasn’t a member of any forums or anything at the time.
Still feel your pain, seems like a stitch up that keeping on pressing decrease bet can end up at a max bet spin.

 

[sapit222]

Has happend to me too, but never such high bet.
20Euro i think was my highest instead of my usual 1Euro.

 

[dealer wins]

Reminds me of my £150 down the drain in 3 £50 bets earlier this year.

So easy to do, and one of the 1st things the UKGC should have banned years ago, but no, they just keep pushing useless popups that have no use whatsoever, and which no player wants!!!

 

[Lemon]

I've done this plenty of times, usually on a slot by some obscure game studio whose staking interface I'm not familiar with. Luckily I only play on VS and my max bet is set to £0.50, so these nefarious accidental spins always get bounced back.
Stake button behaviour should be standardised across all providers. There's no excuse for wrapping back around to the max bet other than to catch people out. It's not right; what are we talking - one or two lines of code to inhibit that? Fucking get it sorted
Perhaps an even more insidious trap is when some games also have the stake options on the autoplay/max loss panel, so when you click £20 you're not selecting 100 autospins at £0.20 a spin, oh no - you're changing stake to £20. I was caught out on that years ago and I think I played a slot on VS very recently that allowed the player to make the same sort of mistake.
As others have said (and I never waste an opportunity either) - the UKGCC should be listening to players' opinions such as these and doing something helpful, rather than imposing their own shite.

 

[chiya]

Happened to me once at VS, I think it was. Wasn't this high of a bet though, but as a lowroller still enough that I'd try my luck at complaining. Considering they have a rep here and all, thought just maybe I might get something but alas .. nothing. Well to be fair, VS do have a max allowed bet you can supposedly set in your profile, I just never knew about it.

Well there was also another time it happened at a bit more dubious casino. It happened during bonus funds too, the game was by iSoftBet and the betting wasn't very obvious. Where I thought I was selecting the bet size (0,50) I was selecting in fact, the coin size. As the spin breached the max bet rules, I immediately contacted the live chat. They basically told me that because i broke the rules I will not be able to cash out anything even if I can reach a point where I otherwise would, but that they would also not refund deposits. I know it was still my fault, but wtf

 

[shadow123]

Sorry to bore you yet again with my £1000 max bet play on a really shitty game at mecca years ago,they would not even consider refunding or compensation,even though i bet no one had ever played at that stake on that game.
Dont think there is any need for a max bet button,anywhere near the start is very dangerous.
I would think there is a case for considering a refund where the stake reverts to max if it is a decrease stake
button.

 

[JGslots]

Remember when you could simply press the space bar on some MG slots on the viper client? Not sure if the UKGC ever put a stop to that or they changed it.

 

[09237653]

My brother did something similar on reactoonz mobile, the mobile version png games autoplay allows selecting of stake, he selected '100' thinking it was 100 spins and did 8 £100 spins, the casino basically said tough titty. I would like to see the ability to restrict betsize on accounts to stop this kind of mistake I believe VS had something like this set up.

 

[Spikie]

I did the same on Dolphins Pearl at £100 spins on a balance of 2k I think ...

4 spins in saw a win of 2k on a very insignificant win line , then noticed the bet size , then cashed out straight away .

It works both ways ,but all slots should load up or revert to minimum base size on crashes or errors.

and maybe if you place a bet say 10x your average amount , it should ask for confirmation.

Thqt shouldn’t be too much to program in for casinos or providers.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

I've checked all the account options at 21Casino and they do have stuff like session duration limits and deposit limits, but nothing to limit betsize, which is definitely something I'd use and set at £2 or maybe even £1, because anything above that and I've done something wrong and I don't want to place that bet.

It is annoying, I mean, who the fuck rocks up to a slot they've never played before, from a provider they've never played before, and says, 'Yep, £125 spin, that's where I'm starting from', even Roshtein Endless 300% Reload Bonus Super Hatman doesn't roll like that, and he gets free money!

One can't help but think that somewhere between the casino itself, and the providers they carry, they'd manage some sort of failsafe that kicks in when someone whose average bet is around 25p over tens of thousands of spins, suddenly decides to make a bet of £125.

Or even just set a default trigger for a 'big bet', so if any player tries to make a bet of over £10, or some other similar amount, you get a popup that says, 'Do you want to unlock betting at this stake? This setting will persist for the rest of your current session.'

Well fuck it, that's the quickest and worst £125 I've ever spent, and I've spunked money on some pretty sketchy shit in my time.

Guess how much slotting I've felt like doing this evening since then?

'Precisely fuck all' would be the correct answer.

 

[colinsunderland]

Personally if you click a button stating decrease stake, then it should decrease it, not increase it.

If you don't get any joy from the casino, then I would make a complaint to them, and copy the UKGC in, as it's hardly responsible gambling, if reducing a stake makes it a maximum bet.

Tagging the rep would probably be helpful

@jacksparks

EDIT: oh another rep who hasn't logged on for well over a week @LadyJelena @Casinomeister

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Personally if you click a button stating decrease stake, then it should decrease it, not increase it.

If you don't get any joy from the casino, then I would make a complaint to them, and copy the UKGC in, as it's hardly responsible gambling, if reducing a stake makes it a maximum bet.

Tagging the rep would probably be helpful

@jacksparks

EDIT: oh another rep who hasn't logged on for well over a week @LadyJelena @Casinomeister

Thanks colin I tried to tag '21Casino' but it didn't work, I knew there'd been some shenanigans around the rep here but that 21Casino still had one, so thanks for that.

It would be nice to get some input from the rep of a casino that is, after all, accredited here at CM.

I'm not suggesting for one second that it wasn't my mistake, but I think there are valid questions around the ease with which one can place a £125 bet, especially from a customer who has never previously placed a bet of above £1 at the casino, and whose average bet is around 25-30p.

 

[dealer wins]

You have my sympathy, and your max bet mistake seems much more "valid" than mine, but on my thread the general consensus was that I was at fault. I was a bit tipsy at the time so that didnt help, it still hurt though as like you I am a low roller and £100 was a week or 2s slot budget.

 

[shadow123]

Can easily be prevented by showing a mesaage saying this spin will cost xxx,are you sure you want to play
at this level,not rocket science, just a matter of if the will is there to do it.

 

[jacksparks]

Hey ChopleyIOM,

I've just sent you a PM. We will also pass this feedback onto the game provider.

Regards,

Jack

 

[Balthazar]

I got burned by Starburst many years ago. I accidentally clicked on Max Bet (which is right next to the spin button) and it silently changed my bet from $0.50 to $20/spin but it didn't actually spin, it just changed the bet size. I never noticed it and I got a whole 5 spins out of my $100 deposit.

My biggest bet on that site was like $0.80 at the time so the GUTS rep here gave me my deposit back. I don't remember his name unfortunately but he was very nice and very active here back then.

I liked the Guts days...I got a few memorable wins there too. They were pretty much kings here for a short period (between the 32Red era and the Videoslots takeover).

 

[ChopleyIOM]

I'd really like to extend my thanks to @jacksparks for resolving this for me.

Having reviewed my account history he has confirmed that the bet was in his opinion clearly placed in error. (As I mentioned earlier, I've made a few deposits/withdrawals from 21Casino and have a fairly chunky game history with them, so he has a decent amount of data on my playstyle.)

As such he has credited £125 to my casino account to put me back in the position I was before placing the unfortunate bet!

Obviously there's no kind of precedent being set here and the casino had no obligation to refund me anything, and I'm certainly going to be more careful in future because I wouldn't expect to be extended the same courtesy twice.

But yes, many thanks to Jack and a very good advertisement for only playing at accredited casinos with reps active here at the forums!

Also as per Jack's post above, he's going to feed back to the provider about this, as it's not a great piece of UI design!

Anyway, a happy resolution in the end

 

[Scott1baird]

I'd really like to extend my thanks to @jacksparks for resolving this for me.

Having reviewed my account history he has confirmed that the bet was in his opinion clearly placed in error. (As I mentioned earlier, I've made a few deposits/withdrawals from 21Casino and have a fairly chunky game history with them, so he has a decent amount of data on my playstyle.)

As such he has credited £125 to my casino account to put me back in the position I was before placing the unfortunate bet!

Obviously there's no kind of precedent being set here and the casino had no obligation to refund me anything, and I'm certainly going to be more careful in future because I wouldn't expect to be extended the same courtesy twice.

But yes, many thanks to Jack and a very good advertisement for only playing at accredited casinos with reps active here at the forums!

Also as per Jack's post above, he's going to feed back to the provider about this, as it's not a great piece of UI design!

Anyway, a happy resolution in the end

Can't resist. Probably didn't wanna sit through an hour or two of one of your videos explaining what happened. Lol

 

[Jono777]

I'd really like to extend my thanks to @jacksparks for resolving this for me.

Having reviewed my account history he has confirmed that the bet was in his opinion clearly placed in error. (As I mentioned earlier, I've made a few deposits/withdrawals from 21Casino and have a fairly chunky game history with them, so he has a decent amount of data on my playstyle.)

As such he has credited £125 to my casino account to put me back in the position I was before placing the unfortunate bet!

Obviously there's no kind of precedent being set here and the casino had no obligation to refund me anything, and I'm certainly going to be more careful in future because I wouldn't expect to be extended the same courtesy twice.

But yes, many thanks to Jack and a very good advertisement for only playing at accredited casinos with reps active here at the forums!

Also as per Jack's post above, he's going to feed back to the provider about this, as it's not a great piece of UI design!

Anyway, a happy resolution in the end

EXCELLENT!

Before I'd even read this post, I pretty much knew what it was going to say!

Transparency and honesty from the start by OP, together with what looks like to be a well run casino, giving IMO the right outcome which I'd hoped for (and thought would happen) from the start

Great stuff Chops!

 

[LadyJelena]

@ChopleyIOM, shall we bring this up to the 21 casino rep?

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Can't resist. Probably didn't wanna sit through an hour or two of one of your videos explaining what happened. Lol

It's a 'conversational style'......

 

[ChopleyIOM]

@ChopleyIOM, shall we bring this up to the 21 casino rep?

It's already sorted thanks LadyJelena, just a few posts up

 

[Siohmy]

Excellent outcome but it does make you wonder with all the affordability to gamble checks how the ability to accidentally max bet for such a huge amount slips the net. I do feel casinos should follow VS lead and have a max stake option in your profile and ADVERTISE IT! One thing I do admire with Sky is that they actively draw your attention to the control limits they have in place. More of this is a good thing.

One of the things from Louis Theroux’s Vegas doc a while back (14 years in fact!) was the response that Vegas wants people to win occasionally and also have a good time. If you make customers feel like they are being looked after they will return. If you make them feel like you are mercenaries then for the cost of £100-200 (ok can hit unlikely huge win) you’ve lost potentially thousands of pounds in consistent revenue. I can see from LeoVegas this my net loss for the last 2 1/2 years is £7k which for the amount and level I play is bloody awful but just goes to show how much even modest gamblers contribute.

 

[TheD]

When I started reading the thread I felt the most fair solution would be to refund half the stake based on the fact they would have paid if you won.

It’s nice to see they went one step further and refunded it all.

I hope they update you with the software providers response. They are the guilty ones here. There is no excuse for such a horrible design flaw.

 

[k6kaysix]

If you think that is bad look at what I saw today on a streamer video, a gentle rise in stakes along the bottom there...

 

[9HOURSAWAY]

I'm happy you got your £125.00 back, glad common sense has won for once.
I guess there is a point to be made that had you hit and won big would you have contacted the casino to arrange a refund?.....I know I wouldn't!

 

[kidgloves]

Serves you right for multi-hearth-stoning-pc-tasking-gambling all at once. You should know women are the only ones that can multi-task
Seriously, that sucks ass. What can you do though.....I cherish my VS £5 max bet limit, except when I want a roasting on the Monopoly Wheel/Crazy Time.
I mean, what percentage of people even bet max these days? We'd be better off with a Bet Min button, it would get far more use but no chance on that.

 

[Playford7]

If you think that is bad look at what I saw today on a streamer video, a gentle rise in stakes along the bottom there...

View attachment 141807

Let’s not mention the ‘s’ word... Covid is bad enough

 

[deanparkr]

Very pleased that thanks to Casinomeister forums and casino rep that you were able to get that refunded. Common sense indeed and I am pleased to hear 21 Casino took the time to look at the account, your history and valued your custom by refunding the bet.

Certainly adding 21 Casino to my mental list of "good casinos".

The design of that bet size button is outrageous however. I'm surprised it is even compliant!

 

[Reckless Bets]

It's an absolutely idiotic design choice to have all the bet values cycle through once you get to the limit, either min or max. It would be a trivial update for the game provider to do. Let's see if they do anything.

 

[gk286]

I think it's time a system is rolled out, bets above a certain size trigger a warning that the bet size is large, are you sure you want to continue.

 

[EkJR]

I remember doing something similar on Foxin Wins a few years ago. £25 bets when I thought it was 50p. 50 lines at 50p it was! Never noticed until the balance was zero from a £200 deposit. Unfortunately the game loaded that way!