High Variance - Understanding it - Loving it.

[3Dice]

Hi All,

We've seen a lot of people from cm join up over the last few days, and with
our (to few) slot machines being of the 'high to very high' variance type, I
think this is a good time to try and shed some light on to the nature of
machines like this, and how you, as a player can make sure to get what you
expect out of it.

First off, a tiny introduction explaining some of the terminology seems
appropriate. In statistics in general, two numbers are considered the most
important to describe a 'sample' or collection of for example winamounts.
Those two numbers are the average and the variance.

These two numbers give a good representation of any collection of numbers,
and are therefor also commonly used to describe how casino games pay. Now
how is this important to the player? Well, as far as average goes .. that's
fairly obvious. The average payout will determine if on the long term you will
win or loose. Unfortunately - there's some bad news here .. all casino games
are designed to have an average below 100% .. the closer to 100% the
better for the player, and if you find one that's above 100%, let me know !

So the first number will give you the average on the long term, and the
second number, the variance, will tell you how long that term is. In
mathematical terms, the variance tells you how far, on average, each of the
results is from the long term payout percentage. So, if we have a machine
with a variance of zero, that means that there is no difference between a
single spin and the average .. so that's a machine that pays out e.g. 0.95 for
every 1 you put in .. not very exciting.

Worded from a player point of view .. high variance means that you can still
be ahead on the casino even after many spins. Eventually everyone will get to
the average, but the higher the variance, the longer this can take..

Now, there's more to it if you're into multiline video slots. Especially the free
spin ones. It is important to know that these machines have a large part of
their payout percentage in the feature. So a session that does not hit the
feature will never be a 'happy' one ..

The good news however is, that it is very easy to calculate the odds on this,
and based on that you can choose a betsize that reflects the expectations
you have. There's only a tiny little bit of math involved, so please bear with
me

As an example, we will use a feature that on average hits 1 in 160 spins. (this
is very close to our supersuits and tut slots). For every spin you have a
chance of 1/160 to hit the feature, so you have 159/160 to not hit the
feature.

Furthermore, we will start with a $100 bankroll, and examine how our choice
of betsize influences the chances of not hitting the feature..

In the first sample, we'll bet $1 ... so we can be sure of 100 spins .. the odds
of not hitting the feature in 100 spins are given by

(159/160) to the power of 100 = (159/160)^100 = 0.5342 = 53.42%

So, with 100 spins .. we have 53% chance of not hitting the feature .. if
however we lower our betsize to 1/4th ($.25) and get in 400 spins ..

(159/160) to the power of 400 = (159/160)^400 = 0.0814 = 8.14%

The sharp reader now notices that 8.14% is not 53.42%/4 .. betting $1 will
make on average 1 in 2 sessions 'loosing sessions', whereas with a bet of $0.5
only 1 in 12.2 sessions (on average) will be one not hitting the feature. With
a high part of the payout in freespins, you want to make sure not to set
yourself up with to little spins ..

Some players are fine with one in two sessions being really low and the other
one really good, others prefer to always get more play for their money. As a
player you can never increase the actual variance of a machine, but all you
need to do to lower it is make sure you get more spins for the same budget,
and thus play lower bets ..

It is up to all of you to decide what your personal preference is, and I just
hope that this post clarifies things a bit for those that did not yet have a
clear view on variance.

In closing, I'll share the exact nrs of the feature frequencies for 3Dice so that
you can do the maths and know what your odds are ..

Tut-Ankh-Amun : 1 in 158
SuperSuits : 1 in 155
Happy Valley : 1 in 135
Squirrel Pike : 1 in 48

As a last word of good advice to new 3dice players, join and play in the
tournaments, they are free, last long, allow all games, very exciting, and the
perfect way to get a good a 'feel' about the games. (oh and they pay real
money )

Good Luck everyone,

Enzo.

 

[KasinoKing]

Hmmm.. I'm not sure how some will take such a post coming from a casino manager...?
But I think it's great & really hits the nail on the head!

Thanks for the feature stats too!

However, I must pick you up on one thing which you of all people should know...

The average payout will determine if on the long term you will win or loose.

It's LOSE for Christs sake, LOSE, not LOOSE!!!!

 

[3Dice]

Hmmm.. I'm not sure how some will take such a post coming from a casino manager...?
But I think it's great & really hits the nail on the head!

We need our sleep at night ..

Greets,

Enzo

 

[tim5ny]

At least he's putting the numbers out there! Try and get that kinda info from RTG or MG. The big boys will only give out a vague payout percentage of overall slots usually. Although their slots are way too tight for my taste, I think 3Dice is going to go a long way in this business because of Enzo's leadership. The people really like him.
On a personal note.. I closed my account after many beatings on the slots and wont go back until there is a variety to choose from. When I play, I tend to have long sessions, and take for instance Microgaming slots......... when a machine goes bad for many spins, then you have a choice of maybe a hundred others to go to, and sometimes the very next machine is hot as a firecracker! You don't have this luxury yet at 3Dice, and I can't survive very long on their Super-High variance slots without being able to run away from the machine.

 

[Mousey]

Thanks Enzo!!

[derail

Hiya Tim! How's it going?!

[/derail

 

[tim5ny]

Thanks Enzo!!

[derail

Hiya Tim! How's it going?!

[/derail

Hi Mousey!

I was going to say something about trying to pick you up when you're playing VP at the casino bar, but I'll refrain. I'm good! I've been enjoying your posts!

 

[cyprean]

We need our sleep at night ..

Greets,

Enzo

What are the slots house edge for slots at 3Dice, 10%, 5%? I could not find audited figures.

 

[tim5ny]

What are the slots house edge for slots at 3Dice, 10%, 5%? I could not find audited figures.

Yeah!.. they'll take your house too!


Sorry Enzo! I couldn't resist!

 

[Rusty]

Hmmm.. I'm not sure how some will take such a post coming from a casino manager...?
But I think it's great & really hits the nail on the head!

Thanks for the feature stats too!

However, I must pick you up on one thing which you of all people should know...

It's LOSE for Christs sake, LOSE, not LOOSE!!!!

KK

...and stop with the exclamation marks already!!!!!!!!!!

Actually I don't know how anyone could take exception to Enzo's post it is simply factual and informative, even helpful.
You can't blame him for a little plug and it is far from spam.

 

[winbig]

Actually I don't know how anyone could take exception to Enzo's post it is simply factual and informative, even helpful.
You can't blame him for a little plug and it is far from spam.

So true. Now if only more casino rep's would take a lesson from Enzo, the world would be a better place!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Rettahs]

Heck, I just wish the max bets per spin were higher. I tend to bet progressively and I always end up hitting the top end too soon there at 3dice. Granted I have won a few tournaments so I can't complain but with my playing style these days I like to go all out to end a session. Oh and the three reelers need some coin variation as well. All in all I have a great time playing in the tournaments .

 

[winbig]

Heck, I just wish the max bets per spin were higher. I tend to bet progressively and I always end up hitting the top end too soon there at 3dice. Granted I have won a few tournaments so I can't complain but with my playing style these days I like to go all out to end a session. Oh and the three reelers need some coin variation as well. All in all I have a great time playing in the tournaments .

Now there's an idea. How about making it so the coin sizes can be adjusted during tournament play? I think that would definitely add more to the skill factor needed to win instead of just max bets until you're broke

 

[Zoozie]

Some players are fine with one in two sessions being really low and the other
one really good, others prefer to always get more play for their money. As a
player you can never increase the actual variance of a machine, but all you
need to do to lower it is make sure you get more spins for the same budget,
and thus play lower bets ..

You can not change the probability for hitting the feature of course. But for a fixed bet size if you instead play few liners but with higher line bet, then this will result in a higher variance slot.

What are the slots house edge for slots at 3Dice, 10%, 5%? I could not find audited figures.

Very good question. I hope 3D will publish the payout%s for all games that can also be seen from within the game (help page etc.) - just like WagerWorks. The 3Dice slots are ~96% payout. And with the highest VIP comp rate, it will give you 2% more, effectively bringing it to 98%.

 

[lojo]

Great info, thanks, Enzo.

You can not change the probability for hitting the feature of course. But for a fixed bet size if you instead play few liners but with higher line bet, then this will result in a higher variance slot.

I've often wondered how this effects features... of course a scatter win that pays x*bet for 3, 4, 5 scatters wouldn't be affected, but if I'm betting .20 per line on five lines, the hits will still be fewer and farther between inside the freespin feature but still worth more... I can't seem to wrap my head around whether I need to use 5* bankroll to achieve the same average as 20 lines @ .01... any help? (Of course that would appear to defeat the purpose, but if it didn't hit in the first +/-150 spins it still might in the next and my point of 'diminishing returns' shouldn't be until my 375th spin.. I think )

Very good question. I hope 3D will publish the payout%s for all games that can also be seen from within the game (help page etc.) - just like WagerWorks. The 3Dice slots are ~96% payout. And with the highest VIP comp rate, it will give you 2% more, effectively bringing it to 98%.

From February...

If I were to make any suggestion to them it would be to establish a relationship with an auditing firm, "All software has met strict criteria to guarantee fairness for our users..." just isn't enough for me. I am impressed with their transparency and their rep's proactive approach to this thread.

Thank you lojo, we do have this on our planning, it is however not an overnight venture and needs to be handled with the propper attention and care.

In another post he went on to explain that for their landbased operations auditing, etc. is all part of the licensing and regulations and that it will take some time to make sure it is done properly with the online casino.

 

[winbig]

I had an interesting run during a tourney last night on Squirrel pike:

Spins: 56

Losses: 53

Wins:

(2) 2 scatters that paid my bet back ($4.50)
(1) $5 win from 3oak

 

[peteyweestro]

n a $50 tourny yesterday i hit the feature twice on the super suits and got a little over $90 each time and on happy valley i was just starting when i hit for $230 then switched to squirrel and hit there for like $60 but still ended up blowing my wad ,the highest i got was 5th place in the standings though

 

[nihtolouloudo]

However, I must pick you up on one thing which you of all people should know...

It's LOSE for Christs sake, LOSE, not LOOSE!!!!

THANK YOU SO MUCH for that KasinoKing

I hope he'll finally learn it! And some others too. It always drive me crazy to see mistakes like this. There are far too many players (also amazing many native speakers) that make the same mistake over and over again. Someone had to tell them!

nihtolouloudo

 

[Trollet]

THANK YOU SO MUCH for that KasinoKing

I hope he'll finally learn it! And some others too. It always drive me crazy to see mistakes like this. There are far too many players (also amazing many native speakers) that make the same mistake over and over again. Someone had to tell them!

Im guilty!

(((HUGS))) Trollet

 

[tim5ny]

Im guilty!

(((HUGS))) Trollet

How can YOU be guilty?? You NEVER loose!

.............. er...I mean Lose!

 

[Trollet]

Oh!
We are not talking about spelling now or?

Ok, im lost now

(((HUGS))) Trollet

 

[lojo]

Thanks for bumping this thread Trollet, we're starting to see some posts from people who should know the variance of 3Dice slots

lose and loose are pet peaves of many posters here (dang

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)

 

[peteyweestro]

i'm not sure if high varience can be applied to poker or other games but it is not only 3 dices slots that are hard to hit, it's any of their games

 

[bernynhel]

Interesting info. I just change slots if I dont hit a feature in a "little" bit. Just because the chances of hitting a feature is 1/150, I can usually hit a feature in under 10 spins if I keep moving till I find a little "riper" slot. Usually by the 3rd or 4th slotif no sooner.

 

[happygobrokey]

or if you stayed on the same one you could probably hit it in under 40 spins as well. you've bought 40 tickets to a 1/150 either way, so you stand a decent chance of hitting it with one of those forty whether you bounce around or stick to one game. perceptively, though, it's nicer to bounce around, because pouring money into one slot with seemingly no luck is discouraging.

you guys really love your slots eh? i feel a new poll coming on (this time casino related)...

 

[tim5ny]

Interesting info. I just change slots if I dont hit a feature in a "little" bit. Just because the chances of hitting a feature is 1/150, I can usually hit a feature in under 10 spins if I keep moving till I find a little "riper" slot. Usually by the 3rd or 4th slotif no sooner.

You cant' move to the next machine too much at 3Dice yet! There's only 4 slots!

 

[hippo925]

hi all,

because of some banking issues, i haven't been able to deposit at 3dice for a week (prepaid visa problem.) been stuck playing at villento, got tired of 500+ spins without bonuses over and over again(shouldn't that be statistically rare on slots like avalon? i know, i know, beating a dead horse) so i closed my account. i only have open accounts at 3dice and Inet now(only deposited once for signup bonus, rtg slots still tight, i see).

so enzo gives me a no wr bonus gift without a deposit for being patient(didn't expect that) and i built it up to $450 !!! will i cash out? maybe a little later just to see how long checks take, but right now it's way too much fun = )

so i don't get it.... 3dice has "high variance" which at first seemed hard to me, but now when comparing to mg, i actually get more bonuses that pay much, much better (supersuits is way fun, if you can get retriggers) i only got one bonus that was less than 60x, most are 100x or much more.

i think the biggest difference with the slots at 3dice is that over time you will lose just like anywhere else, but at anytime you can win more than you started with. with mg, you start with 200, it goes down to 150, you get a bonus that pushes you to 250, than down to 120, than a bonus that pays 10x, than 500 spins without a bonus until you're done.

as i'm typing this, just got two bonuses on supersuits within 20 spins paying 140x and 80x. low betting of course = ) did not have nearly the same fun playing avalon at villento.

anyway, just my take. i think i'm beginning to appreciate the whole high variance thing. just waiting for the new games !!!

 

[saladfingers]

Hippo - you're not alone - I've had exactly the same experience. Totally fed up with MG/RTG software now and their bonus rounds - and at least with 3dice, even if you lose, it feels somehow fairer...

 

[hippo925]

saladfingers,

thanks, at least im not alone. it always kinda ruins it for me when i am able to predict how a session will go. you know, thinking the whole time "well, there's no way i won't get a bonus in X number of more spins..etc because that would be impossible !!! but "impossible" happens way too much, lol

all i know is im having a blast right now on Friday afternoon after a long week of work. i don't have to bet $2.00 anymore to win $100. i can try it now with 30 cents, lol.

good luck everyone and have a great weekend.

 

[tim5ny]

These are definitely high variance slots, and the downside can be as great, if not greater than the upside alot of the time. I've seen both ends of the spectrum, so don't everyone go to 3Dice thinking that they're just giving away the house to every player that comes along.

A good majority of the machine payouts on the big three (King Tut, Happy Valley, and Supersuits) relies on bonus rounds. You cannot survive on these slots without an occassional bonus round... and if one or two bonus rounds happen to be shitty along the way.. like a $5.00 bonus round on .25cents on King Tut (and it happens more than you'd think).. then you're on your way to $0.00 if another bonus round doesn't come in soon and save you. I have lost an $80.00 balance on King Tut more than once at .25cent spins without seeing a bonus round.. or getting one or two VERY bad ones along the way.

On the other hand, the upside is the possibility of HUGE bonus rounds on a very small wager, like my $642.00 bonus round on Happy Valley with a .75cent spin. Others can vouch for the fact that over 100 times wager bonus rounds are pretty much routine on these slots.. and 300X and up are not uncommon.

I happen to like the high variance aspect of these slots, and you may have to get used to how they work before you learn to love them. If you play them enough you can pretty much sense when the next bonus round is due.. and I'd say that maybe 75% of the time my intuition is right. It's hard to explain, but alot of times there's very bad dry spell followed by alot of 2-scatter hits just before the bonus round comes in. And many times when you've had a long dry spell without any bonus rounds.. and your credits have dropped substantially, then you might get 3 or 4 bonus rounds close together and end up way ahead in the credits. These slots take alot of patience sometimes. They're not the kind that I just hit-n-run on like I do at MG or RTG.

The best part is dealing with Enzo and the 3Dice team. Always a pleasure! Got my check in record time. No documents asked for and no hoops to jump through. And to add a personal touch, a hand written note of congratulations along with the check. A class act that will surely make an impact in online gambling. While the "Prima Donna" casinos sit back and act as though we're lucky to be able to give them our cash and play on their casinos, these guys know what it means to appreciate and please their customers.

 

[lojo]

Thanks for the well thought out post. I like these variance discussions, variance is how I stay entertained with slots (some people think they are a dummy's game, drop coin, spin, that's all there is) but they're dead wrong.

I've been adjusting lines wagered and bet size (creating my own variance) since I started playing slots, it was just intuitive to me (tho I didn't have a word for it). At the B&M's my girlfriend would always bet all lines and sometimes increase her bet per line and she could never figure out how I usually came up broke in a hurry or flush for a few days when we would be betting roughly the same amount per spin.

A painless excercise to venture into this: Even if you are rolling .20 or .40 on RTG come up with a number, say .75 so every time your balance is $xx.75 you're going to go high variance with that dangler. Say 3 lines @.25. If you're a higher roller or really bux-up, make it dollar danglers... $355 balance, why not go five lines @ $1 each or if you're feeling brave 11 lines @$5?

Of course you don't want to get carried away and blow your wad, it takes preplanning, self-will and discipline but it can add a hell of a lot of fun to a session. Yesterday I was $50 over my target on an RTG and decided 'all or nothing' with this excess profit so I bet $5 line on ten lines... I got three times my bet. But I would have definitely stopped if it didn't pan out. As luck would have it a couple of spins later I got all five 'schools of angel fish' with a wild on line #8 in crystal waters but I had reduced to .40x20lines That would have paid $12,500 and the wager was 'excess profit'... more than my target, 'free' money.

HV, Tut, SS on 3Dice are already high variance, as we know- and you can't increase the size of your coins (penny, nickle, dime etc.) but you could increase max bet to max on the 'gear' menu - click on the number 3 or 5 on the side of the reels and click the coins to max on those lines without risking 450 or 600 a roll. You've increased the variance by 3x or 5x but also the potential return has increased 3x or 5x (I wouldn't really suggest this method on 3Dice slots as many have noted, the big returns usually come from bonus rounds and you really want all lines bet for free spins)
So, because the slots are so 'bonus-centric' and I can't increase my coin size, I won't do this on 3Dice slots.

MG - Some slots will let you click the line# instead of clicking up or down, and some actually label the line while others show how many coins are bet per line, it's a mixed bag. But I'll usually start with one coin all lines and just increase the size of coin (quicker and easier that way).

I will bet a percentage of my bankroll higher variance whether I'm at a profit or not (but prefer to do it with profits). Why should it be any different than an investment portfolio, mostly low risk, some medium, and a smalll percentage high risk.
{also if I've just won a feature and I'm up 20% it isn't likely I'm going to hit another one right away (stranger things have happened) So I might roll low and medium for 15-20% of my current bankroll, then go high risk for two or three spurts equal to what I was ahead before returning to a steady-ish low-medium risk}

Take a game like Prime Property, Dolphin Tale, or Loaded, be betting 1/5 of your regular wager per line on five lines or 1/3 on three lines, hit the feature, choose the fewest spins for the highest multiplier and if you get lucky SHWIANG!!!!Kaching! On dolphin Tale you've just increased your variance by 8x (40lines/5 you bet) times 20x (highest multiplier in free spins...that's 160 times, or 266x if you bet three lines)

OF COURSE if you think the wins are few and far between now increasing your variance will just make them fewer and farther between (but oh so sweet when they come )

Again: I would only do this with danglers (as RTG example above) or profits, or a small percentage of my original bankroll and I certainly wouldn't play with more than I could afford to lose i.e. still be smiling if I go bust.


bla bla bla... your eyes bleeding yet

Good luck

 

[hippo925]

3dice, now my wife even understands "high variance" = )

so i turned a generous, no wager bonus into over $575 by getting some crazy bonuses betting usually .50, .25, and .30 depending on the game. my wife is impressed. over the weekend, my wife notices that bonuses are kinda hard to get, so i tell her to wait, sometimes they are really exciting.

anyway, my balance falls to under $200 and my wife thinks the games are too hard. she asks me why i play at 3dice and i explain to her that, well, i usually lose no matter where i play anyway, but at 3dice you really have a chance to hit some exciting wins. also, i've been having the most fun i've ever had in long time!!

so last night, my balance falls to under $50 and my wife says "i bet you'll never play 3dice again now.... but i tell her that i plan to only play at 3dice from now on and explain the whole customer service and player raves, etc.

at that point, i hit a crazy bonus on tut, and some more, now i'm at $475 again, lol

i actually had a string of 500 spins without a bonus but i have been conditioned to expect things like that playing mg and rtg slots, lol. don't forget, enzo actually gave us the odds on hitting the bonuses. (lets see, i've gone well over 500 on mg slots, and over 1000spins on rtg slots, and 3dice slots are high variance?)

i've never had a problem losing, it's a part of loving slots. but you want to feel that games are fair and that you ALWAYS have a chance. if i do cash out, i want to know there will be no problems.

by the way, i was going to post that i had a great time playing this weekend even after i lost my bankroll, but that didn't happen. = )

still playing as i type. enjoy the rest of your weekend everyone.

 

[Avatar73]

hmmm...... I'm almost convinced to have a go at 3dice now! Only problem is... I don't play slots anymore! I never did much and now (for various reasons) I simply don't.

ah, and the bonus system is "intelligent" at least! Just seems rather unlikely that I'll end up with anything at all left over after completeing with the games I like! ah well, seems to be keeping many people here happy!

Edit: "Until the wagering requirement is cleared, table limits are set to 50 ($, , €) "

Wow, looks like someone actually reads here, and has taken steps to ban the "big bet"! Top marks for being clearer than clear here... ..... even if i don't think its worth even trying!

 

[lojo]

hmmm...... I'm almost convinced to have a go at 3dice now! Only problem is... I don't play slots anymore! I never did much and now (for various reasons) I simply don't.

ah, and the bonus system is "intelligent" at least! Just seems rather unlikely that I'll end up with anything at all left over after completeing with the games I like! ah well, seems to be keeping many people here happy!

Edit: "Until the wagering requirement is cleared, table limits are set to 50 ($, , ) "

Wow, looks like someone actually reads here, and has taken steps to ban the "big bet"! Top marks for being clearer than clear here... ..... even if i don't think its worth even trying!

Heck you could always skip the bonus on your first deposit and pit your skill and luck against the house edge, then, you know, quit when you're ahead

 

[Avatar73]

Heck you could always skip the bonus on your first deposit and pit your skill and luck against the house edge, then, you know, quit when you're ahead

haha! good point. I guess I'm just not feeling too lucky atm! Also, why is 3 dice not in the accredited section? Or did I miss something?! Seems to be so much good press here that it seems like they should be!

 

[lojo]

haha! good point. I guess I'm just not feeling too lucky atm! Also, why is 3 dice not in the accredited section? Or did I miss something?! Seems to be so much good press here that it seems like they should be!

They're pretty new to online... might not be accredited but they aren't rogue either

 

[KasinoKing]

hmmm...... I'm almost convinced to have a go at 3dice now! Only problem is... I don't play slots anymore! I never did much and now (for various reasons) I simply don't.

ah, and the bonus system is "intelligent" at least! Just seems rather unlikely that I'll end up with anything at all left over after completing with the games I like! ah well, seems to be keeping many people here happy!

Edit: "Until the wagering requirement is cleared, table limits are set to 50 ($, , ) "

Wow, looks like someone actually reads here, and has taken steps to ban the "big bet"! Top marks for being clearer than clear here... ..... even if i don't think its worth even trying!

My personal view?
The 3-Dice SUB sux donkey dick (American Pie - The Wedding) - don't bother with it!
I deposited 50 bucks to try them out last month - had a pretty good features on Super Suits & Happy Valley, then played Tutankhamun until my balance dropped to $100 & cashed out. (100% profit).
The money was instantly in my Neteller account - literally instantly!
Why bother tying yourself into their ridiculous WR? Just give their slots a bash; if you lose - so what? If you win - cash out instantly, no hassles, no worries.
It was a breath of fresh air to me!

 

[kakata]

My personal view?
The 3-Dice SUB sux donkey dick (American Pie - The Wedding) - don't bother with it!
I deposited 50 bucks to try them out last month - had a pretty good features on Super Suits & Happy Valley, then played Tutankhamun until my balance dropped to $100 & cashed out. (100% profit).
The money was instantly in my Neteller account - literally instantly!
Why bother tying yourself into their ridiculous WR? Just give their slots a bash; if you lose - so what? If you win - cash out instantly, no hassles, no worries.
It was a breath of fresh air to me!

Im glad you pointed that $100 withdraw was a 100% profit of your 50 bux deposit.......you saved me a night of calculationing.........lol
Do you already have em as sponsor ? Just curiosity.........

 

[Avatar73]

Well KK, if I lose, then I've just chucked 50 USD or so down the drain, that's the so what!

but good point, if i ever feel like blatting something at slots, I might give 3 dice a look in!

 

[hippo925]

anyone good at math?

first of all, i've had a good time playing at 3dice and i think a lot of casinos can learn from their customer service and payout procedures.

my question is purely out of curiosity since my wife asked me and i suck at math. i had been having good luck playing .25 and .30 cents, but for the last 3 days my luck has been terrible ever since i upped my wagers a little and redeposited. so today, playing supersuits, i went WELL over 1000 spins without a bonus ($540 to $0, betting .45 (most spins) and .75 until the last $100 where i threw some $1.50's and 3.00's)with my wife over my shoulder laughing "no way..." ( i count the number of spins by money lost, so betting .45 = $45 lost = 100 spins, i don't even count the spins from money won so that's how i know it's well over a 1000)

can someone help me and use Enzo'a numbers to calculate the odds on at least 1000 spins without a bonus?

please note, i have had great fun and some great hits that made it entertaining regardless of money lost. in no way should anyone take this as a reason not to play at 3dice because i'm sure the losing streaks are made up for in big hits. this really is just out of curiousity.

my wife (also a slot lover at our indian casinos) won't let me play at 3dice anymore, lol (i make the money, but she's the boss :notworthy ). i told her that it has happened to me at rtg's too, but she thinks things like that should be impossible. i just want to quantify it so i can explain to her that it's not impossible, maybe just improbable ?

also, if someone has the info, what are the odds of not hitting a bonus in 1000 spins on other games, like cleoptra's gold for example. these numbers would be interesting if only to say, "hey, i just did something that happens once in xxx times or did something that has only a xxx% chance of occuring.

anyway, i know some of you are math geniuses so help me out if you can.

also, good luck to you all and hope 3dice keeps up the great work with their customer service and innovative games (impossibly hard at times, but sometimes sooo fun !!)

 

[lojo]

Yip, you lose.

 

[microgamingmug]

first of all, i've had a good time playing at 3dice and i think a lot of casinos can learn from their customer service and payout procedures.

my question is purely out of curiosity since my wife asked me and i suck at math. i had been having good luck playing .25 and .30 cents, but for the last 3 days my luck has been terrible ever since i upped my wagers a little and redeposited. so today, playing supersuits, i went WELL over 1000 spins without a bonus ($540 to $0, betting .45 (most spins) and .75 until the last $100 where i threw some $1.50's and 3.00's)with my wife over my shoulder laughing "no way..." ( i count the number of spins by money lost, so betting .45 = $45 lost = 100 spins, i don't even count the spins from money won so that's how i know it's well over a 1000)

can someone help me and use Enzo'a numbers to calculate the odds on at least 1000 spins without a bonus?

please note, i have had great fun and some great hits that made it entertaining regardless of money lost. in no way should anyone take this as a reason not to play at 3dice because i'm sure the losing streaks are made up for in big hits. this really is just out of curiousity.

my wife (also a slot lover at our indian casinos) won't let me play at 3dice anymore, lol (i make the money, but she's the boss :notworthy ). i told her that it has happened to me at rtg's too, but she thinks things like that should be impossible. i just want to quantify it so i can explain to her that it's not impossible, maybe just improbable ?

also, if someone has the info, what are the odds of not hitting a bonus in 1000 spins on other games, like cleoptra's gold for example. these numbers would be interesting if only to say, "hey, i just did something that happens once in xxx times or did something that has only a xxx% chance of occuring.

anyway, i know some of you are math geniuses so help me out if you can.

also, good luck to you all and hope 3dice keeps up the great work with their customer service and innovative games (impossibly hard at times, but sometimes sooo fun !!)

hippo925 - I lost $2000 on supersuits yesterday and got 1 bonus, which was 3xscatters and gave a return of $200 (playing at $6 stake so about 30x)

Thinking exactly along the same lines as you really, I left MG due to slots going 500+ spins and not hitting even one feature. To be fair 3dice has been pretty good so far, I've had some good wins and big losses there now too.

Last night I considered closing my account as was really p*ssed at supersuits, I went onto squirrel pike and somehow managed to get back up to $1600 with 2 lots of 4xscatters within say 10 spins so put this one down to a bad streak.

At the end of the day nothing is impossible, I know the frustration as the problem is with supersuits is the wins are rubbish off the normal reels so without the feature you can easily take a big hit on there.

 

[Zoozie]

can someone help me and use Enzo'a numbers to calculate the odds on at least 1000 spins without a bonus?

You can read how to do it in this thread:
https://sussexmskpartnershipeast.com/forums/threads/scattered-odds.16965/?highlight=geometric

But you this was for thunderstruck, you just have to use the number Enzo
provided for the slot in question. However this is the general curve and it will not be much different.

 

[devils17]

3dice tuts

after reading the 3dice threads over here i thought i would give it a try

ive played super suits and had the bonus twice in around 200 spins which is great but ive sank around 1000 soins in the tuts slot at 1 and the biggest win i have had is 16 and no bonus at all

 

[hippo925]

thank you zoozie

well, it sucks being the only asian who can't do math but the link zoozie sent gives a general idea of what to expect. interestingly, the odds of hitting the bonus on supersuits and king tut are pretty similar to thunderstruck. ( .065% versus .07%) or (1/155 versus 1/143) i don't play thunderstruck, but from the winner screenshots i know a lot of you do

so if you play thunderstruck, supersuits and king tut should hit bonuses about the same frequency.

so it looks like not getting a bonus on supersuits in 1000 spins is about a 1 in 1000 shot, not getting one in 1300 spins should be about a 1 in 10,000 shot. Enzo said the odds of no bonus in 400 spins is around 8%, 500 spins is 4%, or a 1 in 25.

definitely not impossible. i think i've had hits and runs that were just as statistically improbable (for example, once i got 6 retriggers on tut)

so it looks like i just had a very, very bad and improbable session

but i think it helps to keep things in perspective. so now we know that we should have 500 spins without a bonus only 1 in 25 times. you should go 300 spins without a bonus only 1 in 7 times.

knowing the numbers now, i am sure this is a statistically isolated case and my wife laughing over my shoulder gave me bad luck

 

[hippo925]

snuck in another deposit (my wife said ok, lol) , still losing but much more fun. i think there is so much psychology involved in slots. hit 3 bonuses on supersuits rather quickly for small amounts, but that has to be rare too, doesn't it? i wonder what the odds are on hitting 3 or 4 bonuses quickly, i bet it's just as rare as the 1000 spins without a bonus...

i swear i think that is what makes the 3dice slots so fun and frustrating at the same time...you just can't predict what will happen.

anyway, hopefully i can make my balance last over the weekend, but already got a few bonuses so i'm happy.

i wonder what is the most spins ever spun without a bonus on any slot?

or the most bonuses ever hit in 100 spins?

anyway, have a great weekend everyone.

 

[KasinoKing]

snuck in another deposit (my wife said ok, lol) , still losing but much more fun. i think there is so much psychology involved in slots. hit 3 bonuses on supersuits rather quickly for small amounts, but that has to be rare too, doesn't it? i wonder what the odds are on hitting 3 or 4 bonuses quickly, i bet it's just as rare as the 1000 spins without a bonus...

That exactly hits the nail on the head!
If you hit 3 bonus rounds in say 50 spins you could say that you have used up 465 spins worth of bonuses.
This is the pleasure or pain of high variance slots where most of your winnings come from getting the bonus features & not from the regular reel wins; Hit a few good ones in close succession & you're quids in, hit a dry patch & it's like pulling teeth! With high variance you can't have it both ways.

Hope you hit a biggie next time!