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JackpotLiner - Source of Wealth problem

S

SYPlayer95

Experienced Member
PAB Experienced PAB In Progress
Joined
May 12, 2024
Location
Yorkshire
Good Morning,

Currently doing a run around with jackpotliner.co.uk

In summary, deposited £100. Won £1,200. Requested withdrawal. Headache,

Asking for bank statements for source of funds for deposit? For £100, really?

I am told if I do not comply, they will withhold my funds.

Appreciate any comments.
 
Perhaps that £100 deposit triggered a threshold within the group, Broadway gaming? Not per se the casino it self. Just my thoughts.
 
No, I meant within the group. Did you play at any of their other 30 bingo/casino brands they have? The sum of all your deposits is what they look at. Or they see something suspicious and want to do proper checks.

I am pretty sure it is not the 100 deposit that triggers the requests.
 
An increasingly common theme sadly - you can refuse a CDD request, and if you do they will close your account (which may also restrict your ability to play at their other sites) but
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.

The lower CDD threshold of €1000 / ~£900 (the headline one being €2000 / ~£1800) has been hit by your withdrawal. That means they need to review your account, but does not necessarily mean they have to trigger a source of funds or full proof of wealth request. Sadly, some operators have been using it as a faux-reverse tactic to stall withdrawals illegitimately - and naturally you can keep playing to your detriment.

So there is one key question here - how much, if any, of your winnings was generated after the request was made. If the answer is none, then the entire balance should be covered by the CDD rules in your favour.

You'll note the stress on should, because even if the rules are in your favour - some operators will behave like rogues and try and confiscate the money anyway. While the UKGC have made some effort to clarify the rules, it hasn't really made enough effort to deal with the rogue outfits...
 
Hi Jason,

Cheers for the detailed reply.

To be fair to them, they have stopped me depositing and withdrawing; but have also said they will not process the withdrawal if I do not comply.

They asked for a May-24 bank statement for me to show me proof of funds for depositing £100. Where is the logic? The transaction took place in July for a start...

These jokers won't be getting another penny of my money that's for sure.
 
Update:

After sending the bank statements they requested. They have now asked for a further 3 month bank statements from another account I hold. I just can't see the point in any of this? All for £100 deposit?

I am told from CS that if I do not comply, the account will be closed and the withdrawal will not be processed. Baring in mind that the request for documents was after the deposit and indeed the withdrawal.

What on earth is this about? Is this really the state of UK gambling now?

Surely for £100 deposit a wage slip would have been enough with my salary on? Yet they're wanting more info than a mortgage application.

What is the quickest way to get the money I am rightly owed?
 
I had the same problem last year with a Jumpman site, endless requests for something I couldn’t provide and I eventually self excluded for 1 year from the site , and all Jumpman sites, waited about a week and raised a complaint with them based on UKGC licensing on self exclusion and eventually they paid.
They are awful to deal with.
 
itsme123 said:
I had the same problem last year with a Jumpman site, endless requests for something I couldn’t provide and I eventually self excluded for 1 year from the site , and all Jumpman sites, waited about a week and raised a complaint with them based on UKGC licensing on self exclusion and eventually they paid.
They are awful to deal with.
Click to expand...
Thanks for sharing your experience. I don't get how they can get away with it to be honest. I'm not rolling over for nearly £1,200 though. I've already raised a complaint, you can bet your bottom dollar it will take 8 weeks for a response...
 
I think it goes without saying that something isn't right here. I can imagine that people have completed source of wealth checks (that is, heavy depositors) with fewer documents than that!

There's understandably a lot of frustration around the CDD/AML regulations, but they are a necessity of the modern financial system. Saying that, the checks are supposed to be reasonable and proportional - so a low-roller who gets lucky is a different standard to a high-roller who has deposited many thousands.

If this had happened 2-3 years ago I might have put it down to a misinformed or paranoid operator - but with so much attention on the CDD regulations currently (and the incoming rule changes) ignorance isn't really an excuse - which would only leave malice.

Out of interest, you mentioned they stopped you depositing - are the funds ringfenced and have they stopped you accessing slots or tables? This increasingly sounds like a nasty faux-reverse tactic and if so the UKGC should be stamping it out immediately.

Best of luck getting it sorted!
 
Hi Jason,

You're telling me. Would urge everyone to avoid playing with this operator. If I hadn't have requested £1,200 from £100 deposit, i'd highly suspect there be no need for any documents.

No, I can still play games on the site, with the little bit of bonus balance in the account from free spins.

Yeah, totally agree with the last point, but the UKGC is not fit for purpose. (In my opnion)

I'm waiting to see what they ask for next. I don't understand why they need to see transfers between my accounts. All for £100 deposit.

Madness.
 
Halifax95 said:
I'm waiting to see what they ask for next. I don't understand why they need to see transfers between my accounts. All for £100 deposit.
Click to expand...
Yea, it's excessive - and more akin to checks that high rollers would receive. In that case they want to establish the source of funds (salary, investments etc) and that you aren't being actively funded by a third party (which is partly an AML concern, but also a possible get-out for operators - particularly sportsbooks - to challenge winnings).

For a low roller, it makes no sense because the dynamic is in the other direction - and if this was B2B then you would be vetting them.

Hopefully the incoming changes finally remove this ambiguity - it's clearly caused a lot of resentment in the player base and I would argue is one of the factors that has contributed to the exodus to the high seas (cryptoland).
 
@Halifax95 out of curiousity, can you sum up what you have provided? And you are 100% sure this is your only account at broadway gaming group right?
 
L&L-Jan said:
@Halifax95 out of curiousity, can you sum up what you have provided? And you are 100% sure this is your only account at broadway gaming group right?
Click to expand...
Correct.

I had to provide 11 bank statements across 3 different accounts and a completion statement for the sale of a property. All over a single £100 deposit. Never again.
 
I guess the other statements is a request as a result from reviewing the original statement where they see significants amounts being transfered?
 
L&L-Jan said:
I guess the other statements is a request as a result from reviewing the original statement where they see significants amounts being transfered?
Click to expand...
In summary, yes. Again, can't see why it is necessary given it was a single £100 deposit. A wage slip would have been sufficient (although I still don't see why I would need to provide this), to show I can clearly afford to deposit £100?

Do you not agree how ridiculous it sounds, i;ve had to show a completion statement for a property over a single £100 deposit, just because I won a grand?

Wouldn't be a good money launderer at £100 a time...
 
Yeah thats the problem with these type of verifications. I get your points, 100 dep and 1200 withdrawal should not result in such a request. However, when a bank statement is provided and signficant amounts are being received and sent, additional investigation to those transfers is needed.

So, the best is to use the account where salary comes in, bills are paid from and do bigger transfers from a different account that you don't use for gambling. In that case no additional documents are requested.

I had a little bit of a similar event with my yearly EDD at Party. They ask for tax return or payslip + 3 months bank statement. On my statement you see incoming transfers from Skrill. So their follow up question was 3 months Skrill statement. Little does the employee knew is that I need to withdrawal my party balance to Skrill as they cant process back to my revolut, so I need to use Skrill. And I only use skrill for Party withdrawals :)
 
At least it's all resolved now.

I understand what you're saying. However, I like to keep my gambling transactions seperate from my main bank account.

So are you effictively saying you created a closed loop between skrill and your bank, and therefore they didn't need to see your revolut and that was the account funding the skrill?
 
Halifax95 said:
So are you effictively saying you created a closed loop between skrill and your bank, and therefore they didn't need to see your revolut and that was the account funding the skrill?
Click to expand...
They could have indeed confirmed that on their end, without me needed to provide the skrill statement.
 
Hello have you had your withdrawal honoured yet? I have a similar situation with a Broadway Gaming Site
deposit £300 won £7000 - have closed my account abruptly after 3 weeks of endless documentation providing bank statements / payslips my memorandum of the sale of my house ...........I think i will have to write and complain as I cant even find the complaints procedure
 
brandfold said:
Hello have you had your withdrawal honoured yet? I have a similar situation with a Broadway Gaming Site
deposit £300 won £7000 - have closed my account abruptly after 3 weeks of endless documentation providing bank statements / payslips my memorandum of the sale of my house ...........I think i will have to write and complain as I cant even find the complaints procedure
Click to expand...
Yeah, it was a painful experience, got paid in the end. Live chat were useless.
 
L&L-Jan said:
However, when a bank statement is provided and significant amounts are being received and sent, additional investigation to those transfers is needed.
Click to expand...

I would decline any such requests. It does not matter how this is "justified", it is plain and simple ridiculous unless we are talking about serious sums. Please bear in mind that you as a private company, we do not REALLY know you and your associates and we certainly do not know the friends of your friends not to mention the possibility of a data hack.

Especially for wealthy people, handing out bank statements is a HUGE security risk never mind any other ethical considerations. I wish from the get go that you informed people that there is x threshold and if reached you would need to SOW and therefore as a player BEFORE you deposit you actually know what you are getting into in case you need to withdraw.

If I know that x casino will SOW the hell out of me should I pass 5k in deposits I would have then stayed under the limit or not play there at all. At that point players would have had no issues with AML/SOW procedures. It is the out of nowhere "withdraw halted until SOW is completed" that infuriates us no matter how you justify it. UKGC or not you are a cog in the wheel that participates in this practise so deservedly you get some heat coming your way.

Punters really need to gather together, form a large movement, stop complying and lobby for a change. It is the only way out of this SOW insanity. I am so glad I moved to crypto casinos a while ago and have avoided all this crap.
 
Last edited:
Agree with you.
The thing for me is, it's always at the point of withdrawal. I just cannot see the logic as to I hit a threshold for a withdrawal. The closed loop system is in place. If it has only cost me £100. Regardless of the amount won it should be paid back to the card the money has come from in the first place.
 
uhmz why quote me for your rant, i just give some advice?
 
Halifax95 said:
Agree with you.
The thing for me is, it's always at the point of withdrawal. I just cannot see the logic as to I hit a threshold for a withdrawal. The closed loop system is in place. If it has only cost me £100. Regardless of the amount won it should be paid back to the card the money has come from in the first place.
Click to expand...
There are two primary scenarios here:

The first, where deposits trigger the check - you should be alerted at the first opportunity (i.e. shortly after depositing), but some operators abuse the CDD process and wait until withdrawal (which could be weeks or months later, and the player is unknowingly anti-freerolling themselves because subsequent winnings require a completed CDD).

Under UKGC rules, withdrawals are not supposed to be delayed if the operator could have reasonably asked for the information earlier. This predictably causes a lot of tension because the operator is in the wrong, but the UKGC are ignoring the problem.

Saying that, if you are a higher roller (e.g. £1k+ a month for a given site) then you are likely to be reviewed (including financial documentation) for responsible gambling, CDD/AML or both.

--

The second, where withdrawals trigger the check (as in your case) - this is the common one where people misquote the UKGC rule above.

The handling of these cases varies wildly - some will just be a manual review (e.g. 12-48 hours instead of instant), some will ask for additional identification documents, some will start asking for additional financial information (which raises question marks - this is a withdrawal trigger) and some will absolutely take the piss - as you sadly discovered above.

Annoyingly, the UKGC have ignored the problems here too - and operators have frequently asked for too much information, either as a faux-reversal tactic, or because they are afraid of being snagged for AML failures. The incoming rule changes should help here - but UKGC need to start enforcing action against operators abusing this process for their own benefit.

For what it's worth, with the previous changes to UKGC guidelines regarding identity documentation, it is possible to complete a withdrawal CDD (for the first time) without any additional documents. Namely because they need to verify your identity - which they have done previously - and your deposits are not sufficient to cause an AML check.
 
L&L-Jan said:
uhmz why quote me for your rant, i just give some advice?
Click to expand...
I just highly disagree with the practise that you mentioned hence I quoted it. Nothing personal.

Because of UKGC (and lack of revolt from punters) casinos openly criminalize everyone and ask them to prove that they aren't criminals while many casinos in the meantime withhold their funds.
 
Hi, I’m in the throes of this at the moment. Won £20k. I gambled £500 and hit withdrawal at £19,500 and short of giving them a vile of blood.

I’ve had withdrawals prior but only couple of hundred here and there and it was only when I requested the large withdrawal that they started asking me for a ton of proof. My wife is a financial adviser and she can’t get over how insane it’s all become.

I requested the withdrawal on the 11th of August and I’ve sent, statements, payslips, ID selfie with ID, card confirmation, card statement, joint account earnings statement. What else would they need?

If you could guide me where to start a complaint, that would be great mate, cheers!
 
Hear what you're saying. I've been through it, I just had to comply to get every penny from them.

I just disagree with being asked for documents at point of withdrawal. If they accept your deposits they should pay the withdrawals.

I hear people say you've reached a CDD threshold, but again, disagree with it. Just because you've won, why does that entitle the casino to see all your bank statements?
 
Exactly! They should do that at point of registration. I’m a high stakes but I’m done after this. Sickened by it all.

Thanks for your reply.
 
L&L-Jan, you have been the voice of reason here, but I can't help feeling that there is a reasonable level of cynicism at the amount of requests made to the OP for a £100 deposit.

The logic here also seems bizarre. You absolutely guarantee that the player will never return to your casino, due to the frustration and loss of trust. It is brand cannibalism and for what? £1100?

SOW checks are all part of the process now in the UK, but when they are being used in ways that don't make any sense then it just feels like an ulterior motive is at play. I am very pleased to hear you have finally resolved this issue and have got your money.
 
conker said:
L&L-Jan, you have been the voice of reason here, but I can't help feeling that there is a reasonable level of cynicism at the amount of requests made to the OP for a £100 deposit.
Click to expand...
I can't answer for a different operations, each operator has their own procedures in place. Don't know their procedure.
 
My total deposits are £9198 and total withdrawal £3k. Not a single request for a document until now that their net amount goes from a positive to a negative. That to me seems like a legit ulterior motive
 
BudMol said:
My total deposits are £9198 and total withdrawal £3k. Not a single request for a document until now that their net amount goes from a positive to a negative. That to me seems like a legit ulterior motive
Click to expand...
Well this is curious, because I believe this is the scenario Jan (as a standalone third party - L&L are not linked to Broadway) was suggesting above - and Broadway haven't asked for documents until the big win.

Given the current CDD guidance, It doesn't sound like there's a formal lifetime limit - just how a regulator and/or operator construes "linked" transactions to hit the €1000 lower limit or €2000 headline limit for Customer Due Diligence.

Unlike the OP, you do have significant deposits lifetime so are more likely to be asked for a ton of data - and yes it's ridiculous and at this stage people have probably managed mortgages with less.

My previous observations would equally apply - you can read the CDD guidance yourself to understand the procedure and while you do have the option to comply or not comply, if they're being this difficult already then a refusal may cause more complications.

I don't think a complaints procedure is going to be useful at this point because the operator isn't technically in breach of the CDD procedure - they are just being intentionally difficult to stall you out and hope you'll lose the money back (after all, you have played £500 back - now that you've been asked for CDD you should not play at all until the CDD process has completed, that's one of the worst anti-freerolls you can impose on yourself).

Once you've been paid, I would report it to the UKGC though (since it's no longer a dispute at that point) - they need to realise these antics are still going on.
 
I did think you’d find that interesting. I also believe it was as the point Jan was trying to make as well.

Im not allowed to wager anymore until verification has completed - which was similar for the OP I believe. However the fact they allowed me to wager a further £500 ( which isn’t included in my deposit total ) makes me believe they are stalling.

I’m so frightened they won’t pay out. I read the rules you posted but I was a little confused. If they don’t pay it out do they have to refund all my deposits?
 
BudMol said:
I did think you’d find that interesting. I also believe it was as the point Jan was trying to make as well.

Im not allowed to wager anymore until verification has completed - which was similar for the OP I believe. However the fact they allowed me to wager a further £500 ( which isn’t included in my deposit total ) makes me believe they are stalling.

I’m so frightened they won’t pay out. I read the rules you posted but I was a little confused. If they don’t pay it out do they have to refund all my deposits?
Click to expand...
In fairness, they stopped me depositing as well. So it's not like I could do the balance in. I think they just make it difficult and keep asking for more documents you can't provide as an excuse to close your account and confiscate your winnings.
 
I’ve sent them absolutely every single document they have asked for. For both accounts that I’ve deposited with
 
BudMol said:
Im not allowed to wager anymore until verification has completed - which was similar for the OP I believe. However the fact they allowed me to wager a further £500 ( which isn’t included in my deposit total ) makes me believe they are stalling.
Click to expand...
The withdrawal likely triggers the CDD, so if you withdrew then played on with the £500 that's not ideal (because of the anti-freeroll). Operators that allow people to deposit and/or play while under CDD are clearly trying to trap their players...

BudMol said:
I’m so frightened they won’t pay out. I read the rules you posted but I was a little confused. If they don’t pay it out do they have to refund all my deposits?
Click to expand...
The CDD rules state they should pay out the ringfenced balance (at the time of CDD trigger) plus subsequent deposits if you refuse to comply, but they are obligated to close your account as well. There are a number of problems with that statement though:
  • Sites are a law unto themselves sometimes - so even if they should, they may try and use T&Cs or other tricks to steal the money.
  • If you are a large depositor, if they are concerned about proceeds of crime then that opens a whole different can of worms (which can involve confiscation of funds).
  • Any balances will be locked at the point of the CDD trigger - which as we've seen with other operators, is not necessarily when the player is informed. This opens a really dangerous chasm because the player has different information to the operator - and the time when the CDD is triggered dictates when the pots are split (ringfenced balance, subsequent deposits, subsequent winnings).
    • If a player refuses to comply with CDD, the ringfenced balance and subsequent deposits should be returned, but the subsequent winnings must not.
So given the lack of clear regulations, we can only point people to the pitfalls to avoid...
 
In short, avoid dodgy operators like Broadway Gaming? Probably explains their £100,000 fine several years ago with misleading advertising. If they're doing that, what else are they doing?

In fact, most online casinos have been fined for regulatory failings. Don't trust any of then.
 
Thanks lads.

I made the withdrawal but I continued to play with the remaining balance.

I’ve just logged in to check and here we go again 😖
 

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