PlayHub Casino - accusing me of fraud on slots?

[Hamster 100]

Firstly please excuse my newbie status.... I've been a member here for a very long time but haven't been on for a while, and couldn't locate my original log in details!

On the evening of Thursday 30 April 2020, I decided to look for a new casino to play with having tired of my usual online casinos - many of whom I have been a high rolling slots player for a long time.

I decided to join up to PlayHub Casino (uSoft group, Curaçao license) for a different range of slot games and made an initial deposit of £450.00 - taking no bonus because I do not like to be tied to terms of bonuses, especially involving stake limits. I am and always have been a high-rolling slots player and I only enjoy playing high stake slots games.

I embarked on my usual style of play which is exclusively on slots that offer the purchase of the feature. Upon starting to play a slot time, and a few normal rounds, I decided to purchase the feature, had a lucky round and my balance increased. I continued playing in this style, sometimes winning on the feature, sometimes losing - sometimes to the point of losing nearly my whole bankroll, only to be lucky again, and so on. I was very much enjoying my play and working my way through their 'Swagger Levels' to increase my status on the site.... the higher you are in the levels, the more you can withdraw per month, stuff like that.

I must add during this time I was asked to complete verification and I complied with this at every stage, proving my identity with bank statements, photos of my depositing card, my driving license and even the extra request of myself holding up my passport in a selfie. I was awaiting full verification and would have been able to provide anything else as required.

Over the next few days, I switched games to another slot which also allowed you to buy the feature and allows a higher stake. Due to a healthy bankroll at this stage, I was able to again do some high rolling games, purchasing the feature as per my usual style of play. I played for numerous hours in total - again with my balance going up, and going down. At one point I was down to a very low balance and would have accepted the outcome of this were my next game not randomly a lucky one. I have been in the position before of losing huge sums of money at casinos and I know this is sometimes the outcome.

However, I had accrued a very healthy bankroll at this stage and was on cloud 9 as you can imagine. It has been years since I have had a big win of this kind. Every game I played was fair, originating from my own deposit and I of course have ABSOLUTELY no control over how a feature paid out. Sometimes a £3,500 feature-purchase wager would result in only a £85 win and I accepted that kind of loss on many occasions whilst playing.

During the evening of Tuesday 05 May 2020, whilst in the middle of enjoying a play session, my account was suddenly blocked/banned.
I immediately emailed support to see what was going on as there was no accompanying communication. I was informed by support that my account was being investigated for fraudulent play. After a few back and forth, the support agent stated that my game play was highly unusual and mirrored many fraud cases he has seen in the past and that there is no way I could have won every day for 3-4 days in a row, that the chances of that were "slim to none". If that were the case why would anyone ever play?

And why would the site offer high stake wagers if they didn't expect you sometimes to win big? Of course high rolling is sometimes going to result in high wins. And my game log will clearly show that I often LOST on many of my games, right down to the last game on my bankroll at times.

I don't feel good about this. The accusation of fraud is one thing ... I would never partake in anything such as this nor would I know how. How would that even work playing slots!? Everything I won originated from my own honest deposit, no bonus, and I played a lot with my luck being random, how would I ever be able to control the outcome of a feature?

I am sickened that my large win that made me so happy is now in jeopardy and I just have to sit and wait til they complete their 'checks' which I am sure will find me in breach of their T&C which I am most certainly not. What on Earth can I do? I am an honest, loyal player who only has one consistent play style and I would never do - nor know how to do - anything criminal. Is there still a rep here from PH?

 

[merlinslair]

That's so sad been there a few times for no reason banned and vlocked with some bull about terms and fraud
I hate to say it but my guess they will just find you guilty of some rubbish as they don't obviously want to pay out
Never heard of that casino myself but if its UK then jdjt go to the gaming board with what you say see if they can help
But gutted for. You as we do have lucky streaks and have to go through these hoops.
Not like streamers sadly who just get cashed out everytime every day every minute without even a. Wobble

 

[Borgie]

Pretty sure they do not have a UK licence ?

 

[Luckyscouser45]

Why would you deposit £450 at a Curacao licensed casino :axeman2::axeman2::axeman2:there are so many other reputable casinos available which have a uk license unless your on gamstop i am struggling to understand why

 

[Luckyscouser45]

no uk license I’m afraid you’ve lost your money no way these cowboys would of paid out anyway

 

[Hamster 100]

I just don't understand how they think fraud is possible? Support saying 'this mirrors many fraud cases we have seen'...I can't in a million years fathom how this could actually be achieved (don't worry I'm not looking for advice on how to cheat at slots, I am just genuinely BAFFLED by the accusation - their slots are their own to audit and if they question their payouts ratios then surely thats their own affair to investigate?) I lost easily as many times as I won on my feature rounds. It just so happened to eventually end up on a good bank roll due to RANDOM LUCK with high stakes.

I guess I was foolish to go with PH but I liked the range of unique slots and purchase feature slots on offer for a change... I checked out some reviews and saw comments about payout being fine and support were originally responsive to emails, regarding verifying my account so all seemed to be OK at first.

Support got quite rude with their accusation, telling me they pay out millions worldwide but that they have never seen play like mine before. It's not my fault they are inexperienced with high rollers.

I guess I'll wait to see what they say when they have completed their 'checks' but I am not holding my breath. I hope to at least get my deposit back though.

 

[Luckyscouser45]

I just don't understand how they think fraud is possible? Support saying 'this mirrors many fraud cases we have seen'...I can't in a million years fathom how this could actually be achieved (don't worry I'm not looking for advice on how to cheat at slots, I am just genuinely BAFFLED by the accusation - their slots are their own to audit and if they question their payouts ratios then surely thats their own affair to investigate?) I lost easily as many times as I won on my feature rounds. It just so happened to eventually end up on a good bank roll due to RANDOM LUCK with high stakes.

I guess I was foolish to go with PH but I liked the range of unique slots and purchase feature slots on offer for a change... I checked out some reviews and saw comments about payout being fine and support were originally responsive to emails, regarding verifying my account so all seemed to be OK at first.

Support got quite rude with their accusation, telling me they pay out millions worldwide but that they have never seen play like mine before. It's not my fault they are inexperienced with high rollers.

I guess I'll wait to see what they say when they have completed their 'checks' but I am not holding my breath. I hope to at least get my deposit back though.

They know full well no fraud has taken place. This is just there get it jail card to not pay you. Sadly you will have to just move on from it Cos they aren’t licensed to the uk and are clearly cowboys please play at reputable casinos Cos then at least you have some sort of leg to stand on if anything goes tits up

 

[Hamster 100]

I made sure and asked support first if UK players are fine, which they said yes

 

[Harry_BKK]

PlayHub is a site owned by PornHub. Just sayin'

 

[Borgie]

I made sure and asked support first if UK players are fine, which they said yes

Why did you play there ? They are known for luring players who are on gamstop as they don't do gamstop themselves. All the places you could have played

 

[Luckyscouser45]

PlayHub is a site owned by PornHub. Just sayin'

Really??? :-0

 

[dunover]

I made sure and asked support first if UK players are fine, which they said yes

They are NOT fine as they don't have a license to take UK players.

They are about as straight as a monkey puzzle tree. AVOID!!

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

 

[Hamster 100]

Oh no Am I likely to even get my deposit back? They have stopped replying to my messages and told me just to wait until the team have completed their checks. Is there a rep here at all from Porn Hub or Play Hub or any of the eSoft sites?

 

[dunover]

Oh no Am I likely to even get my deposit back? They have stopped replying to my messages and told me just to wait until the team have completed their checks. Is there a rep here at all from Porn Hub or Play Hub or any of the eSoft sites?

No and no.

We would not deal with scum like this on here anyway, i.e. casinos taking unlawful unregulated deposits.

You could try the PAB service but I doubt you'll get any joy from that.

Player Arbitration Policies and Procedures

 

[Harry_BKK]

Really??? :-0

They started with Pornhub Casino which throws a red flag in many countries and thus the casino did not do well in Google rankings.

They then changed to PH Casino and PlayHub Casino.

 

[Hamster 100]

Absolute scum of the Earth!!!!!

I will PAB when I have heard their final outcome..... nothing to lose!

 

[Harry_BKK]

Oh no Am I likely to even get my deposit back? They have stopped replying to my messages and told me just to wait until the team have completed their checks. Is there a rep here at all from Porn Hub or Play Hub or any of the eSoft sites?

You might need to travel west to Costa Rica if you want to talk to someone from Usoftgaming.

I'm afraid you won't see a penny. A visit to the accredited casino page is recommended at this point: Best Online Casinos Reviews 2020 : Accredited - Casinomeister

 

[Hamster 100]

I know there was a rep on here from PH a while back, he was asking what everyone thought of the porn and gambling combination initiative...

 

[neon claws]

How much did you win?

 

[Hamster 100]

I was around the £50k mark when they blocked me. They said this was impossible from a £450 deposit. But it obviously isn't impossible because it happened.

 

[Hamster 100]

To make matters worse, I've been absolutely longing for a win of this kind for a very long time.... to change my life entirely which it badly badly needs. I was so, so excited to have this luck for a change, only for it to go pear shaped like this.

 

[pinnit2014]

I’d have given 450 quid to a Nigerian Prince before chancers like this.

As said, you can probably (Most certainly) kiss the cash goodbye.

 

[Degen]

Removed I hadn't finished my coffee and was feeling grumpy r

 

[Borgie]

WARNING - Affiliates Who Target Problem Gamblers
Playhub are in here

 

[thr0b]

think youre lying and you were playing fraudulently most likely, you write in a weird way acting over ignorant
what slot were you playing

I would guess that the reason you chose to play there was not "I'm bored of my usual casinos I want to go through the verification bullshit at some new Curaçao casino because reasons" rather they probably had some unique games that you found a way to get an advantage

It is certainly strange that a high-roller bored of their usual casinos would jump to a dodgy casino and carry on spending large sums of money.

 

[Luckyscouser45]

think youre lying and you were playing fraudulently most likely, you write in a weird way acting over ignorant
what slot were you playing

I would guess that the reason you chose to play there was not "I'm bored of my usual casinos I want to go through the verification bullshit at some new Curaçao casino because reasons" rather they probably had some unique games that you found a way to get an advantage

Personally I think the OP is on Gamstop

 

[ladyhawke]

You state that your initial deposit was GBP450. That is not a high-roller deposit by any stretch of the imagination. So were you on a depositing, losing, depositing, losing cycle?

I must admit, on a deposit of that size, your gameplay does seem strange.

So are you willing to share what your overall deposits totalled? And perhaps also the winnings that you are being denied?

 

[Hamster 100]

Sorry if you think I write in an ignorant way, I have autism and have only ever told the truth in everything I have said here and to the casino. Lying is not in my nature. I am now put off by coming on here as this has been upsetting enough and I just came here to get some help or support.

 

[Hamster 100]

I don't dive in with a super large deposit until I have felt the casino out properly with regard to withdrawals and verification etc... so £450 seemed appropriate to just get me started.

 

[Hamster 100]

The firstgames when I purchased feature at say, £10, I could have won £700 or such ( can't remember exact game logs) so then would do a £200 feature purchase and have a good win from that. When i got up to up to £7,000, I started doing feature purchase in the region of £100+ per feature.. I ended up with really good spins and really bad spins but I didn't need to deposit any more as my bankroll kept up.

 

[Jono777]

I hate seeing threads like this one, its hard enough to get ahead these days never mind winning a decent amount and then comes all this BS on top!

From how I digested your OP, the chat / support describe your situation as mirroring fraud cases and not directly accusing you of such.

This being said, I would be interested to know what fable or myth they come up with to keep the ban in place and withhold your winnings, as your rightly confident about will be no case to answer to when it comes to fraud accusations.

I know the horse has bolted now but if ever I was in a position to become a regular hi-roller, I would be 10x more vigilant than I am now when it comes to choosing where to play and trust me, I'm a fussy bugger!

Unlikely, however I wish you best of luck in securing a favorable outcome on this one, keep us posted please!

 

[Degen]

The firstgames when I purchased feature at say, £10, I could have won £700 or such ( can't remember exact game logs) so then would do a £200 feature purchase and have a good win from that. When i got up to up to £7,000, I started doing feature purchase in the region of £100+ per feature.. I ended up with really good spins and really bad spins but I didn't need to deposit any more as my bankroll kept up.

Just say what slot you were playing? Or have they removed it now after discovering you cheated?

 

[Hamster 100]

I haven't cheated in any way shape or form!

The slot games were Chilli Pop and TNT Tumble.

 

[Degen]

I haven't cheated in any way shape or form!

The slot games were Chilli Pop and TNT Tumble.

OH OK sorry. In that case I believe you as they are on many websites.
I was just really sceptical after your first post some subtle things

Well shit, I hope the fuckers burn in hell or you get your money

 

[ladyhawke]

So your deposit wasn't a high-roller deposit, but your gameplay after you started winning was?

A rep for one of the accredited casinos (sorry, but I can't remember which one) stated something along the lines of very large wins from smallish deposits are scrutinised thoroughly - although again, I think the rep actually made reference to a currency deposit of around 25 GBP/$/Eu.

That could simply be the case here. I hope it is, and you do end up getting your winnings.

To add:

TBH, that is the way I play as well. Once I start winning, I increase my bet size, sometimes to stupid levels. Sometimes it pays off. Sometimes it doesn't. No fraud involved at all. And so far - fingers crossed - I have not yet been accused of anything.

Anyway, good luck.

 

[dunover]

I was around the £50k mark when they blocked me. They said this was impossible from a £450 deposit. But it obviously isn't impossible because it happened.

Jesus. 50k, that's an absolute no-no and way past the amount that triggers their default fraudster mode. You'll have supposed rules breaches, if you haven't then they'll change the terms retrospectively to justify stealing the winnings. If they can't do this credibly, you'll get 'security' delays in the hope you spunk it all back, in the meantime. If you really are one of these awkward buggers that actually wants to retrieve their winnings and does insist on being paid, the CS will ignore you then summarily close your account. The whole enterprise is at best tax-dodging and at worst unlicensed criminal money laundering and fraud. Curacao is a black hole for tens of millions of illicitly gained money from other countries' citizens.

EDIT - Chilli Pop, a Betsoft slot. There's a surprise. Like their E.European friends Pragmatic, alas they ain't fussy as to whom they provide their slots and allow them to be used by people who take unlicensed deposits to play them.

 

[thr0b]

Also, £450 in one go IS a high roller deposit amount. That's a quarter of the average UK salary.

At this point, they suspect fraudulent play - IF they are trustworthy, they'll have given you an honest answer, and won't give any information until they've concluded their investigation. This is Correct.

But as they're not trustworthy, you want to hope they find in your favour. As otherwise you've lost, and you've got no comeback.

(Strictly, if they are still part of PornHub, you could complain to their directors, as they ARE a reputable company. But I'm sure I've read somewhere that they sold their interest in the casino sites a while back.)

 

[Davey86]

Fifty thousand English pounds is the sole reason!!!
They don’t want to pay you and they no their is nothing you can do about it period

 

[Mouche12]

Horrible story and I feel for the OP. Dunover is absolutely right, and as mentioned above - please stick to the accredited casinos on this site. I am not sure if a lawyer could offer any help, considering they're crooks and possibly connected to a large mafia network.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Another sister site is Bet Swagger, we had recently a case which sounds awfully similar to yours.

PAB in progress.

Hi there

 

[Hamster 100]

Thank you guys! I will update as soon as I hear from them again, but if not I will chase it myself next week.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I haven't cheated in any way shape or form!

The slot games were Chilli Pop and TNT Tumble.

Here a few details:

PlayHub and Usoftgaming - countries: Curacao, Cyprus, Costa Rica and some country of the former USSR.

As all of these shisters are using a Cypriot company to process payments. PlayHub's cover is Pulsion Processing Ltd. It was registered on 10th Oct 2019 (probably after they had to close the last rogue operation) and has a company Panlegal Limited as only shareholder.

There are three Panlegal companies registered in Cyprus

Panlegal Limited and Panlegal Secretarial Services Limited
Director is ΣΟΥΖΑΝ ΜΑΚΕΔΟΝΑ / Souzan Macedonia .in Greek
Secretary is a Michael Chambers who also owns the lawyer firm Michael Chambers & Co. LLC in Cyprus.

Panlegal Management Limited
Director is Vadim Esipovich (the connection to the former USSR)

All four companies - Pulsion Processing Ltd., Panlegal Limited, Panlegal Management Limited and Michael Chambers & Co LLC share the same address.

You do the maths. That sounds to me like a perfect set-up for a rogue operation to fleece undoubting players. I really don't want to go any deeper as it just gets worse and worse. And any kind of request from players to get paid will be probably laughed off.

 

[slot_zombie]

That's sickening. 50k, Jesus.

 

[Hamster 100]

Thank you for that Harry - it is indeed Pulsion Processing Ltd that shows on my statement. They also asked me to provide a screenshot of my statement showing the money going out to them, which I duly did, at the time of verification.
They told me verification would take 5-8 days hence why I continued spending my bankroll. I had an additional request for a passport/selfie so I thought this was a good sign they were proceeding with my verification. I worked my way up their Swagger Levels to "Gold" and was about to hit "Ruby' meaning £20k withdrawals were allowed a month.

There is a high chance I would have spunked the lot to be honest given the amount of time involved. But when it got to serious life changing sums I had to give myself a reality check and started making real plans for this money. I am very upset. Just clinging on to a glimmer of hope that this will turn out OK.

 

[Hamster 100]

That's sickening. 50k, Jesus.

It was £60k for a while but I had just purchased another go of the feature when they kicked me out ( the feature didn't play out before they booted me!).. balance was just under 50k at that time.

 

[Hamster 100]

So your deposit wasn't a high-roller deposit, but your gameplay after you started winning was?

A rep for one of the accredited casinos (sorry, but I can't remember which one) stated something along the lines of very large wins from smallish deposits are scrutinised thoroughly - although again, I think the rep actually made reference to a currency deposit of around 25 GBP/$/Eu.

That could simply be the case here. I hope it is, and you do end up getting your winnings.

To add:

TBH, that is the way I play as well. Once I start winning, I increase my bet size, sometimes to stupid levels. Sometimes it pays off. Sometimes it doesn't. No fraud involved at all. And so far - fingers crossed - I have not yet been accused of anything.

Anyway, good luck.

This is exactly what I did/do LadyHawke. Thank you, this gives me a glimmer of hope and as another member has pointed out, so far this is just an accusation and they are going to come back to me when they have completed their 'checks'.....

 

[mack341]

Here a few details:

PlayHub and Usoftgaming - countries: Curacao, Cyprus, Costa Rica and some country of the former USSR.

As all of these shisters are using a Cypriot company to process payments. PlayHub's cover is Pulsion Processing Ltd. It was registered on 10th Oct 2019 (probably after they had to close the last rogue operation) and has a company Panlegal Limited as only shareholder.

There are three Panlegal companies registered in Cyprus

Panlegal Limited and Panlegal Secretarial Services Limited
Director is Souzan Macedonia in Greek.
Secretary is a Michael Chambers who also owns the lawyer firm Michael Chambers & Co. LLC in Cyprus.

Panlegal Management Limited
Director is Vadim Esipovich (the connection to the former USSR)

All four companies - Pulsion Processing Ltd., Panlegal Limited, Panlegal Management Limited and Michael Chambers & Co LLC share the same address.

You do the maths. That sounds to me like a perfect set-up for a rogue operation to fleece undoubting players. I really don't want to go any deeper as it just gets worse and worse. And any kind of request from players to get paid will be probably laughed off.

not picking an argument about the Eu but if this is southern cyprus why can these bandits get away with this so easily, I think also morally [though sadly not in reality] he should be able to sue the software company who made the slots, it's their product he was playing. As effectively they are helping/enabling fraudsters, without the slots they can't pull off scams. Imagine if it was a physical casino, surely the slot makers would stop supplying the machines.

This could be a way ukgc and mga could affect the curacao situation, by making it part of the licence provisions on a slot maker not to supply xyz casinos in unlicensed jurisdictions, even sister and shell companies?

 

[Hamster 100]

Mack - thats another thing I don't fully understand - they will toss the accusation around about me somehow "cheating" the slots... but these are their own slots that they host and surely, audit - are they then indirectly admitting their slots aren't safe and are able to be hacked somehow?

I will take this as far as I need to in terms of a resolution so contacting the slots software company is not something I'll rule out.

 

[Hamster 100]

Do you think them looking at my game logs will show them categorically that I have not cheated? They will see my balance steadily going up AND down during my hours of play? Or will they just make up some other reason to void my account and hope thats the end of it?

 

[Harry_BKK]

not picking an argument about the Eu but if this is southern cyprus why can these bandits get away with this so easily, I think also morally [though sadly not in reality] he should be able to sue the software company who made the slots, it's their product he was playing. As effectively they are helping/enabling fraudsters, without the slots they can't pull off scams. Imagine if it was a physical casino, surely the slot makers would stop supplying the machines.

This could be a way ukgc and mga could affect the curacao situation, by making it part of the licence provisions on a slot maker not to supply xyz casinos in unlicensed jurisdictions, even sister and shell companies?

Are you naive or just kind-hearted mate?

The legal jurisdiction applying to the casino is Curacao, good luck getting anything out of there!

You do know that some game providers have two names, one for MGA/UKGC and one for "grey markets". Same games just different names and graphics. It would be the easiest to circumvent.

BTW, MGA is asking casinos that want an MGA licence to list only game suppliers who also have an MGA licence. So something like that is already happening, but how far can a regulator go before it becomes communism-style?