W.T.F Where Has Empathy And Civility Gone ?

[LaurieJim]

I have been watching the news over the past week and it has just been breaking my heart , call me a softie , I really don't care.

It is pathetic when we live in a world where teens kill a jogger at random for the reason , they were bored , this poor guy who was from Australia was a great athlete going to college and did not deserve to die from the lack of these teen thugs lousy upbringing by parents who most likely stuck video games in their hands instead of a book or taught how to love thy neighbor.

My heart and prayers go out to this young mans family and friends , may his cold blooded killers get the same mercy they gave him, none !

Then today I watch about a 88 year old WW2 Vet. who was beaten to death in his car by teen thugs , this man of whom is considered one of those of " The Greatest Generation" was wounded in battle but had his life ended by teens who could not give a shit about what this man gave for the country they live in.

Why can't some parents teach their children that life is precious , I blame society somewhat , we can not whip are kids behinds without being taken to jail or lose our children , I got my butt whipped with a tree limb that I had to get off a tree myself when I did something really wrong and learned not to do it again and I turned out alright , I popped my kids butts when they misbehaved , there still alive and alright.

Is it me or does anyone else feel like we should raise our children and grandchildren like we were?
I mean, we played outside, some of us went fishing and some rode bikes or skated, we did not have video games that taught us how to steal cars, sniper shoot people and all that other violence.
Maybe this is where some of this crap is coming from , I don't know but it makes sense to me, if your babysitter all your young learning years was violent video games and music that contains rape and racial overtones as the norm , then we have huge problems ahead of us.

There is so much trouble around the globe as I type , just saw a clip of children in Syria dead from genocide, no wonder this world is fucked up , excuse my french but WTF !!

Done ranting !

Laurie

 

[Cleveland]

I agree with your post and I would love to comment on this but I'm afraid I'll lose myself in it and likely offend someone. Long story short our society breeds them so its no big surprise when they do what they were breed to do.

 

[secret2]

I agree.

But I am fed up with 'teaching' kids and leading them back on the straight and narrow.

Go to jail and then learn. If you don't learn then back in jail...ok, I'm calming down...

...sorry, I see it every day. There is not a solution but a soft touch only reaches those that have the resources.

The resources are not here, in every town.

I live near Newburgh, NY. It has high crime rate, mainly drug crimes.

Give them a 'job creation' in school...a trade that some can look forward to, when they graduate, or not.

Give them a chance but then if they fail at showing up for trade school after 4 times, then it should be in the hands of the court.

They should know that this a chance to have a 'way out'.

So back to funding..

 

[Nifty29]

IMO it is NEVER OK to hit a child with an implement such as a belt etc, and most certainly NOT a tree branch (which I consider a serious assault).

However, an open hand slap on the hand or backside IS warranted when a point needs to be made about how important something is to learn.

I believe in the punishment and reward system. Kids need rewards and reassurance when they do the right thing, just as much as they need a smack on the bum when they do the wrong thing.

The kids that shot my countryman should face a firing squad ASAP. Guilt is not in question, and prison is only going to make them better and more vicious criminals.

 

[LaurieJim]

I agree.

But I am fed up with 'teaching' kids and leading them back on the straight and narrow.

Go to jail and then learn. If you don't learn then back in jail...ok, I'm calming down...

...sorry, I see it every day. There is not a solution but a soft touch only reaches those that have the resources.

The resources are not here, in every town.

I live near Newburgh, NY. It has high crime rate, mainly drug crimes.

Give them a 'job creation' in school...a trade that some can look forward to, when they graduate, or not.

Give them a chance but then if they fail at showing up for trade school after 4 times, then it should be in the hands of the court.

They should know that this a chance to have a 'way out'.

So back to funding..

Do you feel as someone who teaches that the parenting structure is not like it used to be , parents don't come to meetings to discuss what is going on with their children. I have a friend who also teaches and she said it is like pulling hens teeth to get some of her worst students parents or parent to meet with her, its like a babysitting service and this concerns her as a teacher of 20 plus years as these students are the ones that may be taking care of us one day and that's scary. I applaud all teachers and those in law enforcement as they are great role models when a child is forming ideas and learning about human life.

Laurie

 

[LaurieJim]

IMO it is NEVER OK to hit a child with an implement such as a belt etc, and most certainly NOT a tree branch (which I consider a serious assault).

However, an open hand slap on the hand or backside IS warranted when a point needs to be made about how important something is to learn.

I believe in the punishment and reward system. Kids need rewards and reassurance when they do the right thing, just as much as they need a smack on the bum when they do the wrong thing.

The kids that shot my countryman should face a firing squad ASAP. Guilt is not in question, and prison is only going to make them better and more vicious criminals.

It was a very small tree limb, dummy me thought the smaller the less stinging , I was wrong. I had taken off on my bike and was gone all day long riding with friends, at 10 years old, I can see now where my Mom was upset, no cell phones back then and I did deserve the 3 licks on my tail for that misadventure as I did do wrong.

These thugs that killed your fellow Australian will most likely be tried as adults and get the death penalty we can only hope , I just don't know if Oklahoma carries out their death sentences.

Laurie

 

[chuchu59]

Do you feel as someone who teaches that the parenting structure is not like it used to be , parents don't come to meetings to discuss what is going on with their children. I have a friend who also teaches and she said it is like pulling hens teeth to get some of her worst students parents or parent to meet with her, its like a babysitting service and this concerns her as a teacher of 20 plus years as these students are the ones that may be taking care of us one day and that's scary. I applaud all teachers and those in law enforcement as they are great role models when a child is forming ideas and learning about human life.

Laurie

Laurie,

On the subject of parenting too much has changed since the say 60s or 70s. People were less well-off then and they aspired their children to have a good education and be an asset to society. The children then are parents now. They were brought up with a desire for material wants. They started to provide their own children with much more than basic needs and on average have little time to share with them. Kids now and hooked onto the internet and few kids can communicate with others well. Parents only want their kids to succeed in society and most parents I am acquainted with want their children to be enrolled in elite schools and its not uncommon for them to be enrolled in different classes such as pianoing, singing, ballet dancing. In our days they were more involved in football, swimming, athletics, cooking and these are usually a platform for children to interact with kids of their own age. As these kids slowly grow up they grow more and more solitary and go to extremes to get what they want without sparing a thought for others.

OK finished ranting myself.

 

[secret2]

Do you feel as someone who teaches that the parenting structure is not like it used to be , parents don't come to meetings to discuss what is going on with their children. I have a friend who also teaches and she said it is like pulling hens teeth to get some of her worst students parents or parent to meet with her, its like a babysitting service and this concerns her as a teacher of 20 plus years as these students are the ones that may be taking care of us one day and that's scary. I applaud all teachers and those in law enforcement as they are great role models when a child is forming ideas and learning about human life.

Laurie

Laurie, sorry..I am not a teacher. I just meant as being an adult and 'teaching' by setting an example.

 

[maxd]

IMO it is NEVER OK to hit a child with an implement such as a belt etc, and most certainly NOT a tree branch (which I consider a serious assault).

The principal in my grade school used to discipline me with a piece of rubberised conveyer belt strapping about 3 inches wide and 2 feet long. When that didn't produce the desired results I had to put my hand on his desk and then he layed in with the strap. And you know what? BFD! I lived, no particular harm done, and he ended up going to prison for being a perv. I'd say I learned a few things from the excessive amount of time I spent under the strap, but then who wouldn't? Frankly I'd rather not think about what he learned.

To be fair to the guy I was a little monster and I'm sure he was pretty much at his wit's end. And we lived about 200 miles from Nowhere so things were a little less "well defined" than they might have been where folks had running water and flush toilets.

My point is that people probably make a whole lot bigger deal about the "sensitivities" of children than they ought to. A little well-placed discipline goes a long way because that's just the way the world is. Pretending it isn't doesn't change things much. "Spare the rod and spoil the child" is a shit cliché but there's also a goodly amount of truth in it, IMO. I see people "raising" their kids by letting them flop around on the floor screaming and biting strangers and I can't help but wonder where the "free spirit" ends and the training to be a psychotic boil on the butt of humanity begins.

And no, I don't have kids and nor will I ever. Somewhere along the line I stumbled upon, and recognised, the importance of knowing one's limitations.

 

[Cleveland]

My point is that people probably make a whole lot bigger deal about the "sensitivities" of children than they ought to.

Call at approx 0100 hrs this morning: Shots fired.

Brief summary: 20yo, w/m, hires a prostitute who he meet on ba******.com, a well known prostitute site, but didn't know she was one . She turns the trick, and john decides he doesn't want to pay. Pimp fires 2 shots at the john as john runs for his life. Speak with the john who is clearly intoxicated on pills at the minimum. Mother arrives on scene before police because he called her instead of calling the police. It took her daughter to call the police once the daughter find out about the incident from mom.

I ask why the police weren't called in front of the mother. That typically indicates something is being hidden and there is more to the story.

Immediately the mom tears into me: "He is just a poor scared baby, he didn't know any better, hes just a baby."

The guy is 20, intoxicated on pills at minimum, in a seedy part of town, with a prostitute whom he had met a number of times prior.

Main problem in all of this. John was driving in his intoxicated state to get to the location. Tried to flee in his vehicle from the location in the intoxicated state. Could have killed someone while driving. John chose to do something that brings a bad criminal element to the area, which puts other citizens lives at risk. That shot could have easily killed someone else. The list goes on. But he is just a poor baby who doesn't know any better.

 

[LaurieJim]

The principal in my grade school used to discipline me with a piece of rubberised conveyer belt strapping about 3 inches wide and 2 feet long. When that didn't produce the desired results I had to put my hand on his desk and then the layed in with the strap.

And you know what? BFD! I lived, no particular harm done, and he ended up going to prison for being a perv. I reckon we both learned a thing or two from our time together: I learned something about how being in charge and handing out the pain has nothing to do with being right; frankly I'd rather not think about what he learned. To be fair though I was a little monster and I'm sure he was pretty much at his wit's end. And we lived about 200 miles from Nowhere so things were a little less well defined than they might have been where folks had running water and flush toilets.

My point is that people probably make a whole lot bigger deal about the "sensitivities" of children than they ought to. A little well-placed discipline goes a long way because that's just the way the world is. Pretending it isn't doesn't change things much. "Spare the rod and spoil the child" is a shit cliché but there's also a goodly amount of truth in it, IMO.

And no, I don't have kids and nor will I ever. Somewhere along the line I stumbled upon, and recognised, the importance of knowing one's limitations.

Amen to that !! I meant earlier to say" keen switch " not tree limb and anyone growing up in the country or small town can probably relate, We also had discipline in school , it was a paddle with holes drilled in it but I never wanted no part of that so I behaved , back in my day , if you got a paddling at school more than likely you would be punished at home as well by your upset parents.

Laurie

 

[Cleveland]

I know I said I wasn't going to comment much...

but I just want to say this. Parents need to start taking more interest in what their kids are doing and where the kids are. They need to stop making so many excuses about why their kids did something. Stop trying to be the best friend, and start being the parent. If police, a teacher, or any authority figure came to my parents house in reference to me, both of my parents would say "what did he do, because I know my child." They won't go into the whole "he would never do that, not my child," speech. Granted they will defend me when I need defending but they also won't make excuses for me.

The twerking video that got those kids suspended from school, that so many parents are saying was wrong. Here is a thought. If your child thought they were mature enough to dance on video as if they were a stripper, then they should have been mature enough in their thinking to know if the video is being recorded it would likely be put up on youtube and other social media websites. Instead of being worried about the kid who posted the video, maybe you should be worried about your teenage daughter "twerking" with a guy standing between her legs (one scene from the video). *****I know this doesn't apply to y'all, I'm just getting a little upset here*****

Point in all of my ramblings:

I've had 13 year old kids tell me they talked back to their parents because they felt they should be allowed to do what they want to do, or "she was talking to me crazy and I didn't want to hear all that." To this day I respect my parents. I'm 31 yoa, married, with a career, and our own place. Yet I watch what I say around my parents. And if I'm ever getting too carried away or out of line, when mom gives that dreaded look. I shut up immediately. Her being a tiny 5'5 at best, and barely weighing anything, and me standing at 6'0, and a healthy 240 lbs, I think that says something. My dad commands the same respect, but I tend to say mom a lot, because I will admit, I've always been a momma's boy

They raised me to respect them, and I still see them as the alphas of our family. Not my best friends.

 

[skiny]

Kids need a firm hand right from day one. You can have fun with your kids, joke around with them, make light of situations that aren't that serious but in the end they have to learn to respect authority and respect the rules. They also have to learn patience and understanding. So that's the balance you have maintain with them. That's how they learn it.

When I raised my kids they very rarely saw me angry. They also knew the tone and the look that said you have to listen and you have to respect what I'm saying. I would never argue with my children. They didn't have right to argue with me. I didn't preach to them or make them sit through a lengthy scolding either. When they were doing things they weren't supposed to do I'd ask them why. I think they would rather have just been scolded because I seriously expected an explanation. But it did make them think about what they were doing and why they were doing it.

Most of the time I would just be sarcastic with them or make fun of them. I reserved the look and the tone for things that were serious. They knew when I was being stern they really did something wrong. This was just my style and it worked for me. I never had to spank them. If they knew they did something that pissed me off that seemed to be enough to make them get teary eyed anyway.

I remember once when the boys were small and they said goodnight and headed off to bed. Almost the second the door closed it sounded like two kangaroos were having a party on the beds. I walked down the hall and opened the door and they were bouncing up and down like the beds were trampolines.

They saw me open the door and the bouncing stopped. I said "The hallway's only about 9 feet long. It couldn't have taken you more than 6 steps to get down it. How in the hell did you both lose your minds in the 8 seconds since I saw you last?" They didn't speak. They kind of shrank down under the covers and stayed pretty quite for the rest of the night.

When the oldest boy was about 15 he had a girl over visiting one afternoon and I walked into the living room where they were watching a movie. I asked "Who took the last cookie out of the bag?" And he says "I did." So I said "Were you expecting the cookie fairy to come by later on and fill it back up?"

He got up, walked passed me. Took the empty bag out of the cupboard and put it in the garbage. Then sat back down without saying a word.

The girl he had visiting just sat there laughing at him.

99.9% of the time that's how I dealt with things. When I stopped making jokes they knew they were really in trouble.

 

[just play]

Laurie, I just don't know. I have been thinking about this since you posted.

I would think one of the differences from when we grew up there was a mother and father in the house with the mother home with the children. My friends would get scared when their mothers would say "wait until your father gets home". But then I think how I grew up with no mother, she got up and left when I was 7, literally one day just left, never heard from again. (but that's another story) So, my brother and I grew up with only my father.

I agree with Cleveland, I am 42, married with 2 daughters and I still do what my dad says. My husband even "obeys" him. lol.

What changed over the years? Tv, internet, video games, both parents having to work? There were murders when we were young of course, but not like today. So, again, what has changed?

Onto when I had my 23 year old at the age of 19. I was more of a friend, not much of a parent, but that's my fault not hers. Her teenage years were very tough (but that's another story as well, lol) Giving her that look or tone of voice still works with her. She turned out ok, she's always been a hard worker, is very friendly, and VERY respectful of her grandparents on both sides. My 11 year old is much more mouthy than she was, why is that? You would think the older one would be more mouthy growing up with a young parent. But even 23 years ago was a much different time. I think I am more strict with the younger one, but she's "worse" than the older one was. It's really weird. Maybe she sees the way her friends are with their parents and tries it out on me? But why are those parents allowing that?

If only things could be the way they were.

 

[kauphy]

:notworthy

Kids need a firm hand right from day one. You can have fun with your kids, joke around with them, make light of situations that aren't that serious but in the end they have to learn to respect authority and respect the rules. They also have to learn patience and understanding. So that's the balance you have maintain with them. That's how they learn it.

When I raised my kids they very rarely saw me angry. They also knew the tone and the look that said you have to listen and you have to respect what I'm saying. I would never argue with my children. They didn't have right to argue with me. I didn't preach to them or make them sit through a lengthy scolding either. When they were doing things they weren't supposed to do I'd ask them why. I think they would rather have just been scolded because I seriously expected an explanation. But it did make them think about what they were doing and why they were doing it.

Most of the time I would just be sarcastic with them or make fun of them. I reserved the look and the tone for things that were serious. They knew when I was being stern they really did something wrong. This was just my style and it worked for me. I never had to spank them. If they knew they did something that pissed me off that seemed to be enough to make them get teary eyed anyway.

I remember once when the boys were small and they said goodnight and headed off to bed. Almost the second the door closed it sounded like two kangaroos were having a party on the beds. I walked down the hall and opened the door and they were bouncing up and down like the beds were trampolines.

They saw me open the door and the bouncing stopped. I said "The hallway's only about 9 feet long. It couldn't have taken you more than 6 steps to get down it. How in the hell did you both lose your minds in the 8 seconds since I saw you last?" They didn't speak. They kind of shrank down under the covers and stayed pretty quite for the rest of the night.

When the oldest boy was about 15 he had a girl over visiting one afternoon and I walked into the living room where they were watching a movie. I asked "Who took the last cookie out of the bag?" And he says "I did." So I said "Were you expecting the cookie fairy to come by later on and fill it back up?"

He got up, walked passed me. Took the empty bag out of the cupboard and put it in the garbage. Then sat back down without saying a word.

The girl he had visiting just sat there laughing at him.

99.9% of the time that's how I dealt with things. When I stopped making jokes they knew they were really in trouble.

:notworthy lmao

 

[LaurieJim]

Laurie, I just don't know. I have been thinking about this since you posted.

I would think one of the differences from when we grew up there was a mother and father in the house with the mother home with the children. My friends would get scared when their mothers would say "wait until your father gets home". But then I think how I grew up with no mother, she got up and left when I was 7, literally one day just left, never heard from again. (but that's another story) So, my brother and I grew up with only my father.

I agree with Cleveland, I am 42, married with 2 daughters and I still do what my dad says. My husband even "obeys" him. lol.

What changed over the years? Tv, internet, video games, both parents having to work? There were murders when we were young of course, but not like today. So, again, what has changed?

Onto when I had my 23 year old at the age of 19. I was more of a friend, not much of a parent, but that's my fault not hers. Her teenage years were very tough (but that's another story as well, lol) Giving her that look or tone of voice still works with her. She turned out ok, she's always been a hard worker, is very friendly, and VERY respectful of her grandparents on both sides. My 11 year old is much more mouthy than she was, why is that? You would think the older one would be more mouthy growing up with a young parent. But even 23 years ago was a much different time. I think I am more strict with the younger one, but she's "worse" than the older one was. It's really weird. Maybe she sees the way her friends are with their parents and tries it out on me? But why are those parents allowing that?

If only things could be the way they were.

I wish I had the answers , I swear I do !

The world we grew up in just does not exist anymore, we need more role models for our youngsters such as our policemen and policewomen , our teachers/ Firefighters and those who want them to be all they can aspire to become. These over paid drug loving athletes and rock stars are not the answer as role models and violent video games are darn sure worse.

Laurie

 

[skiny]

I wish I had the answers , I swear I do !

The world we grew up in just does not exist anymore, we need more role models for our youngsters such as our policemen and policewomen , our teachers/ Firefighters and those who want them to be all they can aspire to become. These over paid drug loving athletes and rock stars are not the answer as role models and violent video games are darn sure worse.

Laurie

The parents are supposed to be the role models but first they have to act like it. The young girl that my son had visiting used to come out with us quite often. Her parents weren't good role models. She saw a police car one time when we were out and started insulting them in the back seat to my son. I started asking questions. It ended up being a long conversation. I wanted to know what she had against the police although I knew her parents liked to have parties and they had run ins with the law. She couldn't really come up with a sound reason to have anything against them. I'm sure this attitude came from her parents since they had a history of getting in trouble. I told her I never mind having the police around because I'm not doing anything illegal. And I asked her a lot of questions like "Do you think people should be allowed to break the law?.... Well, who's going to stop them if there are no police?" In the end she just agreed that having the police around was a good thing. Sometimes you just have to point out the logic.

The first time she came to my house she had the baggy pants on with her underwear showing. I was taking the kids with me into town and I asked her if she wanted to come. She said yes so I said "Ok, first pull up your pants." And she did.

Then I said "Now, I don't want to see your underwear again unless they're sticking out of a laundry basket... And I don't plan on spending too much time in your laundry room."

I never saw them again.

 

[cpdnd31]

Here is what's happening in Chicago : let's see oh father of 5 month old baby admitted he smothers child and threw baby in Zion waste dump. They are now searching to find dead baby. Mother will be charged as well she was DOPED up as it was happening.

Chicago Cop responding to call. Gets out of car and beaten over head with baseball bat -- several times over - he is now fighting for his life.

We can talk about the drugs, the games, the bad parenting but honestly I think its babies that had babies and have no clue how to raise um. Lack of education. Lack of respect. This generation thinks its all about them. Immediate gratification god forbid they have to wait on a new release of something. They have no clue. I went to try and find a place for my son to volunteer a couple of days a week =. he pissed me off when he asked me why he had to help an old guy shovel. When I was done explaining to him we respect our elders they built this nation. I then explained to him maybe he needs to understand what it is like to service people. Well not one place would take him because he was under 16. So I took the snow blower gave him a hand shovel and said dont come back until everyone on our block has a clean sidewalk. He learned the hard way but he now respects everyone.

When he was about 10 he said I'm leaving here I'm running away. i said OK strip. He looked at me as I started undressing him. MOM MOM what are you doing. I said you came into this world butt ass naked. I have given you everything including your clothes. If you want to leave you leave with what is yours. So strip. He freaked out so bad LOL... Said he was sorry and then realized his mistake. Then we were able to talk rationally about what was bugging him. he has never ever tried that line on me again by the way. LOL

People need to slow down and learn how to communicate, they think just because we talk on a computer we are all friends, no a friend is someone you play ball with, go to movie, call and say hi too. I like you all but I dont know you. I'm glad your here but would you come to my home at 3 am if I needed you too? To Much information causing to much confusion in this world and honestly kids just don't know who to trust or where they belong anymore. It is sad.

 

[maxd]

When he was about 10 he said I'm leaving here I'm running away. i said OK strip… Then we were able to talk rationally about what was bugging him. he has never ever tried that line on me again by the way.

LOL! Now that is some good, old-fashioned parenting! And _so_ Chicago. Great story.

 

[Balthazar]

Can't have good parenting when you don't have a good family base. The family concept started exploding 30 years ago and it went downhill from there. Kids need a mom and a dad + a good balance between friendship and an authority figure.

 

[cpdnd31]

Yes but here is the main thing missing I think. When we were young every neighbor on my block and the blocks around us knew who we were. If i got busted running through a yard. that neighbor had my parents number and they were on the phone quicker then I could say I'm sorry. Everyone looked out for each other. We could play outside till midnight on a weekend, their could be a group of us and never a problem. We knew better, we knew if mom or dad wasn't home that the neighbor was and they would speak up.

It does take a village to raise a child, and if that village is screwed up to begin with what do you think the child will become?

Just so you know, The neighbors here have my number, and when the local Subway sandwich shop opened up, and my son with a group of his friends started going there after school, I walked into that shop in front of the kids introduced myself gave them my number, said these kids I know and if there is one issue, call me. I will come and handle it. Then I turned to my group of kids and said OK have fun but if you screw up he will call and I will call each of your parents. NEVER been a problem,

I try to give them their freedom but let them know their freedom comes with a price.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yes but here is the main thing missing I think. When we were young every neighbor on my block and the blocks around us knew who we were. If i got busted running through a yard. that neighbor had my parents number and they were on the phone quicker then I could say I'm sorry. Everyone looked out for each other. We could play outside till midnight on a weekend, their could be a group of us and never a problem. We knew better, we knew if mom or dad wasn't home that the neighbor was and they would speak up.

It does take a village to raise a child, and if that village is screwed up to begin with what do you think the child will become?

Just so you know, The neighbors here have my number, and when the local Subway sandwich shop opened up, and my son with a group of his friends started going there after school, I walked into that shop in front of the kids introduced myself gave them my number, said these kids I know and if there is one issue, call me. I will come and handle it. Then I turned to my group of kids and said OK have fun but if you screw up he will call and I will call each of your parents. NEVER been a problem,

I try to give them their freedom but let them know their freedom comes with a price.

I think this is the main thing missing. Now, it's a case of neighbours being told "DON'T INTERFERE", so they stay quiet. There is also such a high level of "pervert paranoia" that many are too afraid to have anything whatsoever to do with the children of their neighbours, such that if they are doing wrong, a blind eye is turned, rather than scolding the kids or risking a "DON'T INTERFERE" tirade from the parents. This leaves the only viable option of calling the police, but in nearly all cases, the incident is so minor that it's a case of turning up long after the event, and then trying to "have words" with the parents, who often see the police as "killjoy" interfering busybodies.

On top of this, we have the state dictating in increasing detail just how we should bring up our kids. This can mean some parents just leave everything up to the state, which means the schools. Once things are allowed to go far, getting things back on track can be impossible as savvy kids know that they can effectively blackmail parents, teachers, and neighbours by making up, or exaggerating, incidents and reporting them to the authorities. they then come along with a bias of "the complaint came from the child, so the adult is presumed guilty till proven otherwise".

Comedy has illustrated this by the frequently used sketch involving a kid who effectively says to another adult in authority "give it me or I'll tell **** you touched me", and the sketch always ends with the kid getting their own way. Comedy is a reflection on society, and I am sure 30 years ago no comedian would even think such a sketch likely to get a laugh, and so wouldn't even try it.

 

[catapultaudio]

I have been watching the news over the past week and it has just been breaking my heart , call me a softie , I really don't care.

It is pathetic when we live in a world where teens kill a jogger at random for the reason , they were bored , this poor guy who was from Australia was a great athlete going to college and did not deserve to die from the lack of these teen thugs lousy upbringing by parents who most likely stuck video games in their hands instead of a book or taught how to love thy neighbor.

My heart and prayers go out to this young mans family and friends , may his cold blooded killers get the same mercy they gave him, none !

Then today I watch about a 88 year old WW2 Vet. who was beaten to death in his car by teen thugs , this man of whom is considered one of those of " The Greatest Generation" was wounded in battle but had his life ended by teens who could not give a shit about what this man gave for the country they live in.

Why can't some parents teach their children that life is precious , I blame society somewhat , we can not whip are kids behinds without being taken to jail or lose our children , I got my butt whipped with a tree limb that I had to get off a tree myself when I did something really wrong and learned not to do it again and I turned out alright , I popped my kids butts when they misbehaved , there still alive and alright.

Is it me or does anyone else feel like we should raise our children and grandchildren like we were?
I mean, we played outside, some of us went fishing and some rode bikes or skated, we did not have video games that taught us how to steal cars, sniper shoot people and all that other violence.
Maybe this is where some of this crap is coming from , I don't know but it makes sense to me, if your babysitter all your young learning years was violent video games and music that contains rape and racial overtones as the norm , then we have huge problems ahead of us.

There is so much trouble around the globe as I type , just saw a clip of children in Syria dead from genocide, no wonder this world is fucked up , excuse my french but WTF !!

Done ranting !

Laurie

Laurie, I agree with your over-arching point entirely, that there is a severe lack of empathy/civility in our recent generations, but hate the fact you seem to hold video games almost single handedly responsible. How old are you, can I ask?

I have just turned 30, I spent quite a lot of time as a child playing video games - I think it's important to note games back then were very different to video games today, but if your main point of concern is just that somebody may have played video games, full stop, as opposed to 'reading a book or being taught to love thy neighbour', then the differences are not actually so relevant .. I don't think those video games I played did me any harm, in fact they inspired me to want to write games myself and today I'm a professional programmer(albeit not games software...)

Many parents today like to keep their children indoors because there is far more danger outside than there was in the days you allude to .. and many games now have a social aspect that we could only dream of in my day - today, whole groups of friends regularly engage in a game on-line together whilst chatting on their headsets about their day at school or whatever, i really think for most people it is a very positive experience and those who it corrupts are the same ones who were previously corrupted by violent films, or violent books before that, etc etc ... some people are just made that way, it is not the video game that is the problem, in most cases, I would wager.

As for 'Rape and racial overtones' ... hell, you do make it all sound a bit sinister, but for the most part I don't think rap music is going to cause global rioting either ... !

Perhaps my own outlook on this is just too different to yours for us to fully comprehend the others view, I sure would be interested to hear WHY you feel the way you do that these things have directly influenced society so drastically ... I myself find it interesting that the hysteria games like 'Cannon Fodder' and 'Mortal Kombat' caused in the 90s is completely absent today despite the obviously far, far higher violent and sexual content of games - it seems this viewpoint has fallen out of fashion with the media at large, so it's interesting to know that it is still out there elsewhere.

 

[LaurieJim]

Laurie, I agree with your over-arching point entirely, that there is a severe lack of empathy/civility in our recent generations, but hate the fact you seem to hold video games almost single handedly responsible. How old are you, can I ask?

I have just turned 30, I spent quite a lot of time as a child playing video games - I think it's important to note games back then were very different to video games today, but if your main point of concern is just that somebody may have played video games, full stop, as opposed to 'reading a book or being taught to love thy neighbour', then the differences are not actually so relevant .. I don't think those video games I played did me any harm, in fact they inspired me to want to write games myself and today I'm a professional programmer(albeit not games software...)

Many parents today like to keep their children indoors because there is far more danger outside than there was in the days you allude to .. and many games now have a social aspect that we could only dream of in my day - today, whole groups of friends regularly engage in a game on-line together whilst chatting on their headsets about their day at school or whatever, i really think for most people it is a very positive experience and those who it corrupts are the same ones who were previously corrupted by violent films, or violent books before that, etc etc ... some people are just made that way, it is not the video game that is the problem, in most cases, I would wager.

As for 'Rape and racial overtones' ... hell, you do make it all sound a bit sinister, but for the most part I don't think rap music is going to cause global rioting either ... !

Perhaps my own outlook on this is just too different to yours for us to fully comprehend the others view, I sure would be interested to hear WHY you feel the way you do that these things have directly influenced society so drastically ... I myself find it interesting that the hysteria games like 'Cannon Fodder' and 'Mortal Kombat' caused in the 90s is completely absent today despite the obviously far, far higher violent and sexual content of games - it seems this viewpoint has fallen out of fashion with the media at large, so it's interesting to know that it is still out there elsewhere.

Well these are some games I think have had a bad influence on our children , Grand Theft Auto, Call of Duty , Halo , Total Recall ,these are games that teach car theft, life like sniper murders and torture , not like the games you played as a child.

Not all Rap music is bad just like some rock and country songs, our young people would rather idolize these stars and they are not good role models , just as some athletes and movie actors. There is more to life than those I mentioned and some children do not know better as they are being babysat by these video games instead of learning about empathy and ones service to others less fortunate and respect for their elders, wouldn't you agree?

I am 50 years old and pretty damn hip for my age , have twin daughters (28) and a 29 year old son almost your age

Laurie

 

[vinylweatherman]

Laurie, I agree with your over-arching point entirely, that there is a severe lack of empathy/civility in our recent generations, but hate the fact you seem to hold video games almost single handedly responsible. How old are you, can I ask?

I have just turned 30, I spent quite a lot of time as a child playing video games - I think it's important to note games back then were very different to video games today, but if your main point of concern is just that somebody may have played video games, full stop, as opposed to 'reading a book or being taught to love thy neighbour', then the differences are not actually so relevant .. I don't think those video games I played did me any harm, in fact they inspired me to want to write games myself and today I'm a professional programmer(albeit not games software...)

Many parents today like to keep their children indoors because there is far more danger outside than there was in the days you allude to .. and many games now have a social aspect that we could only dream of in my day - today, whole groups of friends regularly engage in a game on-line together whilst chatting on their headsets about their day at school or whatever, i really think for most people it is a very positive experience and those who it corrupts are the same ones who were previously corrupted by violent films, or violent books before that, etc etc ... some people are just made that way, it is not the video game that is the problem, in most cases, I would wager.

As for 'Rape and racial overtones' ... hell, you do make it all sound a bit sinister, but for the most part I don't think rap music is going to cause global rioting either ... !

Perhaps my own outlook on this is just too different to yours for us to fully comprehend the others view, I sure would be interested to hear WHY you feel the way you do that these things have directly influenced society so drastically ... I myself find it interesting that the hysteria games like 'Cannon Fodder' and 'Mortal Kombat' caused in the 90s is completely absent today despite the obviously far, far higher violent and sexual content of games - it seems this viewpoint has fallen out of fashion with the media at large, so it's interesting to know that it is still out there elsewhere.

Except there isn't. What there IS is far more information about the dangers we have always faced, but that in the past we knew little about.

The more obvious dangers like traffic outside schools is caused by the very parents that complain about all the traffic outside the schools that makes them feel they have to drive the kids there.

We are actually far safer from the more sinister dangers if the technology we have now is used properly and sensibly, such as being able to call home from wherever you are, and whenever you feel threatened. Parents should never be faced with not knowing where their kids are with the sensible use of the modern cell phone, properly set up by the parent, with the importance of which being fully understood by the kids such that they don't think it's "cool" to tamper with it to prevent anyone from being able to trace them in an emergency.

Look at the danger UK children were in when placed in the care of the BBC in the 1970's, where parents thought them far safer being supervised by the celebrity stars Jimmy Saville and Gary Glitter than by some neighbour in their street. We THOUGHT it was safer then, but now we know that our kids are no safer in the hands of our popular TV stars than they are with any other person we know very little about personally.

 

[Cleveland]

I'm glad your here but would you come to my home at 3 am if I needed you too?

Hell yes, that I would.....

 

[skiny]

An understanding of good moral values and acceptable behaviour has to start at an early age. Children need to learn patience, tolerance, respect and empathy before they develop a sense of independence. Young adults will make their own choices and these choices should be based on a solid foundation of morality learned while they grew up. This doesn't require two parents or specifically a father or mother to be present. Many single parents have raised upstanding young adults and many criminals have come from a two parent family. It does require a perseverance and a stubbornness. A constant awareness of the kind of values your children are learning which will not only come from you but also the people you associate with.

If children learn and accept there are ways they cannot behave, rules that cannot be broken and ways they cannot treat people at home, they are more likely to accept these facts at school or on the street. I've always found it useful to get children to try to explain why they did something wrong rather than just tell them it was wrong and then punish them for it. I've try to be as calm and logical as possible when dealing with children. I think children need to learn that getting angry is not a productive response when dealing with a problem. And when problems are minor the reactions should be minor. That's why I prefer to make jokes about it rather than make a bigger deal of things than they need be but when there is a real problem the jokes need to stop and a real conversation is warranted.

I think children need to learn that all actions have consequences. They just don't all need to be severe.

Once we sat down to dinner and there was a nice big pork chop, some potatoes and vegetables on our plates. My son looked down at his plate and said "I don't like pork chops."

I said, "Really? I do" while reaching across the table, stabbing his pork chop with my fork and dropping it on my plate.

Then he looked down at his now almost empty plate and over at his mother with the best "WTF?" look I ever saw.

I think I taught my kids a pretty good sense of morality and a good sense of don't screw with dad.

 

[just play]

Once we sat down to dinner and there was a nice big pork chop, some potatoes and vegetables on our plates. My son looked down at his plate and said "I don't like pork chops."

I said, "Really? I do" while reaching across the table, stabbing his pork chop with my fork and dropping it on my plate.

You told that story before and I laugh at it every time.

I do something different. For some reason every time we have spaghetti my youngest daughter ALWAYS says "I don't like spaghetti". I say "so starve", and don't make her a plate.

My husbands comment is..."do you think we are running a restaurant"?


Somehow she eats all her spaghetti.

 

[skiny]

You always have to maintain authority. I really hate watching kids arguing with their parents or worse, yelling at them.

Once my son was having a heated argument with his mother in the basement. His friend was there and they wanted to go out. I think she wanted him to clean his room or do some sort of housework. I went downstairs to see what the yelling was about and told my son to go upstairs. I guess he was still angry because he turned and yelled at me. Then his friend said to him something like "Just go. Maybe we can go to the beach tomorrow." (I used to take them to the beach in the summer a few times a week.)

I said "He's not going to the beach tomorrow, he has a doctor's appointment." My son looks at me now all totally confused and says "For what?" I said "I don't know but any kid yelling at me in my house must have something wrong with him."

His friend started laughing at him and he kind of put his head down, said sorry and went upstairs.

His mother never seemed to learn that you'll never win fighting with a child. If they know they can make you angry they'll do it on purpose. Kids will continuously test your authority. If kids don't respect the authority of their parents, who's will they respect?

 

[just play]

You always have to maintain authority. I really hate watching kids arguing with their parents or worse, yelling at them.

Once my son was having a heated argument with his mother in the basement. His friend was there and they wanted to go out. I think she wanted him to clean his room or do some sort of housework. I went downstairs to see what the yelling was about and told my son to go upstairs. I guess he was still angry because he turned and yelled at me. Then his friend said to him something like "Just to. Maybe we can go to the beach tomorrow." (I used to take them to the beach in the summer a few times a week.)

I said "He's not going to the beach tomorrow, he has a doctor's appointment." My son looks at me now all totally confused and says "For what?" I said "I don't know but any kid yelling at me in my house must have something wrong with him."

His friend started laughing at him and he kind of put his head down, said sorry and went upstairs.

His mother never seemed to learn that you'll never win fighting with a child. If they know they can make you angry they'll do it on purpose. Kids will continuously test your authority. If kids don't respect the authority of their parents, who's will they respect?

This is the most accurate statement I ever read.

I already said before in this thread I wasn't the best mother with my oldest daughter. Me and her used to go at it like cats and dogs as she aged. (mid teens) When she was in her early teens she used to bug me and bug me about going to a dance or where ever when she was punished. I always gave in and let her go. She even told my younger daughter "if you want to do something just keep bugging mommy and she will let you go" I had to have a talk with the older one and have her tell the younger one she was only kidding about that, and she never did that, and she was just joking.

Sometimes it's not so fun having one daughter 12 years older than the other.

 

[LaurieJim]

This is the most accurate statement I ever read.

I already said before in this thread I wasn't the best mother with my oldest daughter. Me and her used to go at it like cats and dogs as she aged. (mid teens) When she was in her early teens she used to bug me and bug me about going to a dance or where ever when she was punished. I always gave in and let her go. She even told my younger daughter "if you want to do something just keep bugging mommy and she will let you go" I had to have a talk with the older one and have her tell the younger one she was only kidding about that, and she never did that, and she was just joking.

Sometimes it's not so fun having one daughter 12 years older than the other.

Kids will test you to the very end and if they have a sibling , they will play one parent against the other and are darn good at it , its as old as we are, they just have learned how to master it better.

You are a wonderful mother from just reading your posts , you care about your children and that says alot, no parent is perfect , it is always a learning adventure even when they grow up and have children themselves.

My mama always told me , Babies do not come with manuals or we would be perfect parents and they perfect kids lol .

Laurie

 

[dandan]

My younger sister was a brat to my mother. She always managed to run rings around her and also influence my even younger sister... 18 months difference between the 2. She would abuse Mum, run away... do everything possible to make all our lives a misery.
Mum worked hard as a single parent and also worked in law enforcement. Didn't make the slightest jot to my sister. In fact I think it was worse because she thought she could get away with more than other kids who didn't have a parent that worked in law.

Mum... and our Dad too (whom are good friends and is an all round good bloke) have always taught us to treat others as you'd like to be treated.

The 'brat' has now turned out an exceptional person... someone am proud to call my sister!! It just took her awhile to figure it out! Somewhere... and time all those decent values that our parents taught us sunk in!!!

Kids should have rights... but parents have rights too!