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Secret Societies, The New World Order, and you.

I think it is time that people in general were made aware of the true intentions of TPTB, whom control most of world`s leading countries. The last time 5-6 of them organised a world event it cost the lives of 78 million `Useless Eaters` including both my granddads, resulting in me facing a childhood without the best partner a young boy could have - his granddad, it is a well known fact amongst those that research the New World Order, the next target for reducing the world`s population is a reduction of roughly 90% and everything is nice and neatly in place for that, all you need once again are those 5-6 men in charge of the world`s most powerful countries and media manipulation, nothing more, nothing less, create a false reason for enforcing the following retaliation (in this case Iran having nuclear capabilities) initiate yet another false flag event. But, this would have an obvious flaw, as Iran does not have nuclear weapons their target of a 90% world population reduction would be impossible to reach?, easily solved, all they need is one of the players whom does have nuclear power to take Iran`s side.......

q8ffAeeDC2o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8ffAeeDC2o (have to copy paste this one)

Anyway`s back to the plot, I will be contributing a huge amount of relative information in this thread and will update it accordingly when I have the time, I openly invite people to add bits and ofc debate with me, but, I will state this now, I have very little time for those whom offer nothing to the topic bar their own brash opinions based on what they have heard on TV or read from a book written by a disinformation specialist.

Most of what I write will be backed up by a reliable authenticated source, enforced by indisputable evidence (when applicable), this relative information will be but not limited to - Eye witness testimonies, scientific calculus and formulae, video evidence, and a whole heap more.

You may ask the question - `Why does Roy worry about these aspects so much?`, the answer is simple, this affects us all, and most of you are good, no, great people.

Others will ofc just fob me off as yet another nut job Conspiracy Theorist, all I will state here is - go do some research and find out just how many CT`s turned out to be true, the most famous ofc will be the one that in times gone past would brand people like me as a heretic, resulting in being executed, that CT was the Earth being round, and not square. Everyone knows my stand on 9/11, all I will add here is -

There are several challenges out there that carry generous rewards for anyone that can supply the relative data and a conclusive clarification on how the three towers that day (WTC1 -2 -7), defied the laws of physics including the most obvious - Newton`s 3rd Law of Motion F = ma - The Conservation of Momentum, (which is gravity based and means - a falling object follows the path of least resistance,) at nigh on free-fall speeds, which in laymen terms means - around 90 storeys of the towers (WTC1-2) which by all accounts were not damaged by either the plane or fire (which they were articulary designed to withstand and increased in both strength and integrity the nearer to ground level they were), offered absolutely no resistance at all and were reduced to dust before they hit the ground.

So, all I will say to those who believe the official account of 9/11 - don`t waste your time here debating with me, go and earn yourself a few hundred thousand dollars from the rewards put forward by the physics experts and constructional engineers/architects out there that are offering them, most of these rewards have been out there for nearly 11 years, and yet, not a single one of the millions of worldwide physic`s and construction experts have put forward a worthy enough hypothesis to claim a reward.

Like I say, you can believe NIST`s explanation of how the towers fell which was based on *an allegedly* reconstructed model of the towers that cannot ever be verified, because, and I quote `It would jeopardise public safety`, here is the lead engineer of NIST John Gross sidestepping a very valuable question regarding one of 1000`s of anomalies that day, how the temperatures and heat, were several hundreds of degrees hotter (and the resulting affects) than any inflammable substances could have possibly created?.........




So, who do you believe?, the many 1st responder accounts, technical experts, science/physics experts, constructional/architectural engineers, or, a man, employed by the government, whom can blatantly be seen lying, and has never had to disclose the relative data regarding NIST`s analysis of the collapses.


The Rise of The Illuminati.

The very 1st secret society that we are aware of, had (unlike today) a pure, noble, and honourable motive - to safeguard the Holy Grail, a goblet used by Jesus as he dined with the 12 disciples and depicted by Leonardo Da Vinci in his famous painting - The Last Supper, these were collectively known as The Order of the Knights Templar founded by the Crusader Knights in 1118 in Jerusalem in the Holy Land, but, as like many other aspects of life, greed, power, wealth, was to rear it`s ugly head, an early sign of character assassination and manipulating the public in general was clearly evident as King Philip the IV of France who was deeply in debt put immense pressure on the church to denounce the the Templars with false allegations of apostasy, idolatry, heresy, obscene rituals and homosexuality, financial corruption and fraud, and secrecy.

Statements from imprisoned Templars that were obtained via torture and after more bullying from Philip, Pope Clement then issued the papal bull Pastoralis Praeeminentiae on November 22, 1307, which instructed all Christian monarchs in Europe to arrest all Templars and seize their assets.

Roughly 4 hundred years after a new society appeared - The Freemasons, Freemasonry has incorporated Templar symbols and rituals in a number of Masonic bodies, as with any secret society, unless you are part of them, you will never know their true intentions, were the Illuminati and Freemasons somehow linked?, you decide.....

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Famous Quotes About "Depopulation".



Depopulationists think the earth's population needs to be DECREASED BY 90%. Learn how to protect yourself from sterilization, mercury in vaccines, fluoridation of water, pesticides, genetically modified organisms (GMOs), plus nuclear, chemical and biological weapons like DU, chem-trails, anthrax, AIDS & bird flu.

"One CFR published policy objective is substantial worldwide depopulation including half of the current U.S. population being targeted. This population reduction program is largely funded by the Rockefeller Foundation and the Merck Fund, both financially and administratively linked to the Merck pharmaceutical company--the world's leading vaccine manufacturer. Records show the Merck pharmaceutical company received a major share of the Nazi "flight capital" at the close of World War II when its president, George W. Merck, was America's biological weapons industry director. These facts were revealed by Norman Covert, Army public relations director at Fort Detrick in Frederick, MD, and veteran news correspondent Paul Manning in his book "Martin Bormann: Nazi in Exile" (Lyle Stuart, Inc, 1981)." — Dr. Leonard Horowitz

"Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"One way to carry out this disapproval might be to insist that all illegitimate babies be put up for adoption—especially those born to minors, who generally are not capable of caring properly for a child alone. If a single mother really wished to keep her baby, she might be obliged to go through adoption proceedings and demonstrate her ability to support and care for it. Adoption proceedings probably should remain more difficult for single people than for married couples, in recognition of the relative difficulty of raising children alone. It would even be possible to require pregnant single women to marry or have abortions, perhaps as an alternative to placement for adoption, depending on the society." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"Adding a sterilant to drinking water or staple foods is a suggestion that seems to horrify people more than most proposals for involuntary fertility control." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"A program of sterilizing women after their second or third child, despite the relatively greater difficulty of the operation than vasectomy, might be easier to implement than trying to sterilize men." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"The development of a long-term sterilizing capsule that could be implanted under the skin and removed when pregnancy is desired opens additional possibilities for coercive fertility control. The capsule could be implanted at puberty and might be removable, with official permission, for a limited number of births." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"In today’s world, however, the number of children in a family is a matter of profound public concern. The law regulates other highly personal matters. For example, no one may lawfully have more than one spouse at a time. Why should the law not be able to prevent a person from having more than two children?" — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"Perhaps those agencies, combined with UNEP and the United Nations population agencies, might eventually be developed into a Planetary Regime—sort of an international super agency for population, resources, and environment. Such a comprehensive Planetary Regime could control the development, administration, conservation, and distribution of all natural resources, renewable or non renewable, at least insofar as international implications exist. Thus the Regime could have the power to control pollution not only in the atmosphere and oceans, but also in such freshwater bodies as rivers and lakes that cross international boundaries or that discharge into the oceans. The Regime might also be a logical central agency for regulating all international trade, perhaps including assistance from DCs to LDCs, and including all food on the international market." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"The Planetary Regime might be given responsibility for determining the optimum population for the world and for each region and for arbitrating various countries’ shares within their regional limits. Control of population size might remain the responsibility of each government, but the Regime would have some power to enforce the agreed limits." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"To date, there has been no serious attempt in Western countries to use laws to control excessive population growth, although there exists ample authority under which population growth could be regulated." — John P. Holdren, Obama’s science advisor, Ecoscience 1977.

"The resultant ideal sustainable population is hence more than 500 million but less than one billion." — Club of Rome, Goals for Mankind

"In order to stabilize world population, we must eliminate 350,000 people per day. It is a horrible thing to say, but it is just as bad not to say it." — Jacques Cousteau, 1991 explorer and UNESCO courier

"I believe that human overpopulation is the fundamental problem on Earth Today" [and] "We humans have become a disease, the Human pox." — Dave Foreman, Sierra Club, co founder of Earth First!

"We don’t want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population." — Margaret Sanger

"MAINTAIN HUMANITY UNDER 500,000,000 IN PERPETUAL BALANCE WITH NATURE" — Anonymously commissioned Georgia Guidestones

"Society has no business to permit degenerates to reproduce their kind" — Theodore Roosevelt

"If I were reincarnated I would wish to be returned to earth as a killer virus to lower human population levels." — Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, leader of the World Wildlife Fund

"A total population of 250-300 million people, a 95% decline from present levels, would be ideal" — Ted Turner, founder of CNN.

"And advanced forms of biological warfare that can "target" specific genotypes may transform biological warfare from the realm of terror to a politically useful tool." — The Project for a New American Century, Rebuilding America’s Defences, p. 60, Dick Cheney and Paul Wolfowitz

"Whatever the price of the Chinese Revolution, it has obviously succeeded not only in producing more efficient and dedicated administration, but also in fostering high morale and community of purpose. The social experiment in China under Chairman Mao’s leadership is one of the most important and successful in human history." — David Rockefeller Banker, Honorary director of Council on Foreign Relations, honorary chairman of Bilderberg Group & founder of Trilateral Commission. Member of Bohemian Club, praising Chairman Mao, whose policies killed at least 30 million people.

"Every one of you who gets to survive has to bury nine." — Eric Pianka

"[Disease] will control the scourge of humanity," — Eric Pianka

"I do not pretend that birth control is the only way in which population can be kept from increasing. There are others, which, one must suppose, opponents of birth control would prefer. War, as I remarked a moment ago, has hitherto been disappointing in this respect, but perhaps bacteriological war may prove more effective. If a Black Death could be spread throughout the world once in every generation survivors could procreate freely without making the world too full. There would be nothing in this to offend the consciences of the devout or to restrain the ambitions of nationalists. The state of affairs might be somewhat unpleasant, but what of that? Really high-minded people are indifferent to happiness, especially other people’s." — Bertrand Russell (1872-1970), Philosopher

"The most merciful thing that a family does to one of its infant members is to kill it." — Margaret Sanger

"Eugenic sterilization is an urgent need … We must prevent multiplication of this bad stock." — Margaret Sanger

"Eugenics is… the most adequate and thorough avenue to the solution of racial, political and social problems." — Margaret Sanger

"The big threat to the planet is people: there are too many" — Sir James Lovelock

"My three main goals would be to reduce human population to about 100 million worldwide, destroy the industrial infrastructure and see wilderness, with it’s full complement of species, returning throughout the world." — Dave Foreman, US environmentalist and co-founder of the environmental movement Earth First!

"The extinction of the human species may not only be inevitable but a good thing." — Christopher Manes, Earth First!

"Childbearing should be a punishable crime against society, unless the parents hold a government license. All potential parents should be required to use contraceptive chemicals, the government issuing antidotes to citizens chosen for childbearing." — David Brower, first Executive Director of the Sierra Club

"I wish very much that the wrong people could be prevented entirely from breeding" — Theodore Roosevelt

"The Puerto Ricans are the dirtiest, laziest, most dangerous and the Ivish race of men ever inhabiting this sphere… I have done my best to further the process of extermination by killing off eight and transplanting cancer into several more." — Dr Cornelius Rhoads (1898-1959) | Rockefeller Institute, Rhoads also headed two large chemical warfare projects, had a seat on the AEC (Atomic Energy Commission), and he headed the Sloan-Kettering Institute for Cancer Research

"I have studied with great interest," he told a fellow Nazi, "the laws of several American states concerning prevention of reproduction by people whose progeny would, in all probability, be of no value or be injurious to the racial stock." — Adolf Hitler

"While we were pussyfooting around…the Germans were calling a spade a spade." — Whitney, executive secretary of the American Eugenics Society, declared of Nazism

(referring to sterilizations) "The Germans are beating us at our own game." — Joseph De Jarnette, superintendent of Virginia’s Western State Hospital, 1934

"From an historical point of view, the first method which presents itself is execution . . . Its value in keeping up the standard of the race should not be underestimated." "Applied Eugenics" also devoted a chapter to "Lethal Selection," which operated "through the destruction of the individual by some adverse feature of the environment, such as excessive cold, or bacteria, or by bodily deficiency." — In 1918, Dr. Paul Popenoe, the Army venereal disease specialist during World War I, co-wrote the widely used textbook, "Applied Eugenics"

"Instead of recommending cleanliness to the poor, we should encourage contrary habits. In our towns we should make the streets narrower, crowd more people into the houses, and court the return of the plague." — Thomas Malthus

"Englishmen Francis Galton to describe the "science" of bettering human stock and the elimination of unwanted characteristics… and individuals. Galton proposed societal intervention for the furtherance of "racial quality," maintaining that "Jews are specialized for a parasitical existence upon other nations" and that "except by sterilization I cannot yet see any way of checking the produce of the unfit who are allowed their liberty and are below the reach of moral control." — Francis Galton

"The Aids epidemic, rather than being a scourge, is a welcome development in the inevitable reduction of human population… If it didn’t exist, radical environmentalists would have to invent [it]." — Dave Foreman, the founder of the environmental group EARTH FIRST!

Francis Crick, who together with James Watson is credited with the ground breaking discovery of the double-helix structure of DNA, declared at a conference shortly after receiving the Nobel Prize that the "reproductive autonomy" of human beings could not be tolerated in the future. Among other things, Crick suggested the idea of adding a chemical to public water supplies, that would make men and women sterile; only those who qualified for a "license" to produce children, would be given an antidote drug.

"We have to take away from humans in the long run their reproductive autonomy as the only way to guarantee the advancement of mankind." — Francis Crick

Alexander Graham Bell advocated passing laws (with success in some states) for compulsory sterilization of people deemed to be, as Bell called them, a "defective variety of the human race."

"If the youth is content to abandon his previous associates and to throw in his lot whole-heartedly with the rulers, he may, after suitable tests, be promoted, but if he shows any regrettable solidarity with his previous associates, the rulers will reluctantly conclude that there is nothing to be done with him except to send him to the lethal chamber before his ill-disciplined intelligence has had time to spread revolt. This will be a painful duty to the rulers, but I think they will not shrink from performing it." — Bertrand Russell, "The Scientific Outlook", 1931

"The first task is population control at home. How do we go about it? Many of my colleagues feel that some sort of compulsory birth regulation would be necessary to achieve such control. One plan often mentioned involves the addition of temporary sterilants to water supplies or staple food. Doses of the antidote would be carefully rationed by the government to produce the desired population size." — Paul Ehrlich, The Population Bomb

AIDS and other diseases will be the COVER STORY for the decimation. The real causes will be starvation, contaminated water (which has existed for a long time), toxic vaccines given to people who are already immune-suppressed, wars, and of course, stolen farmland. [2003] Depopulation and HIV by Jon Rappoport

Investigations by EIR have uncovered a planning apparatus operating outside the control of the White House whose sole purpose is to reduce the world's population by 2 billion people through war, famine, disease and any other means necessary. [1981] The Haig-Kissinger depopulation policy by Lonnie Wolfe

Rockefeller also told Russo that his family's foundation had created and bankrolled the women's liberation movement in order to destroy the family and that population reduction was a fundamental aim of the global elite. Rockefeller Admitted Elite Goal Of Micro chipped Population

"A million Armenians and 30,000 Kurds were killed in this country (Turkey) and I am the only one who dares to talk about it." -- Orhan Pamuk (Observer 23 Oct, 2005)

Apparently it was a decision reached by the secret government. The final decision was made in the White House in 1972 on the basis of a meeting of world leaders under Nixon. A friend of mine got the notes from that. He's now in prison, and he talked about it publicly in 1974. He said that they had the meeting and agreed that the planet was overpopulated and that it had to be reduced. The decision was to reduce the population from 5 billion, which it was at that time, to 1 billion by the year 2000. They were to use any and all means to do this. They believed that the earth could only handle 1 billion inhabitants. Their problem was how to exterminate 80% of the world population in 30 years. They modified the figure to be 2 billion by 2000, but the AIDS thing is going to take care of a good part of that for them. The latest figures coming out of Washington indicate that Africa is now as good as doomed. In another ten years, 75% of Africa will be dead. ORION TECHNOLOGY AND OTHER SECRET PROJECTS Al Bielek and Preston Nichols

Through World Health Organization inoculations that were contaminated with the virus. The first program was in black Africa in 1974 with the smallpox inoculations. They then went to Brazil and other Hispanic countries and did it there. In 1978, they laced the gamma globulin for the Hepatitis B vaccine because the homosexual population was the greatest consumer. That's why it showed up first in the United States in the homosexual population and why it was claimed to be a homosexual disease. Nothing could be further from the truth, but it was something the Evangelists took up quickly, saying that AIDS was "Gods curse on the homosexual". People didn't worry about it who weren't gay. The people who planned this didn't figure on the ability of the virus to mutate. ORION TECHNOLOGY AND OTHER SECRET PROJECTS Al Bielek and Preston Nichols

My investigation proves that biological agents were not only developed and used in the Persian Gulf war, but that they are in fact part of the Global 2000 population downsizing program..........the information that I want to get out to the American people is that the Gulf War illnesses are actually communicable diseases. The microbes will live almost indefinitely, but for a minimum of seven years. It's on the gas masks, the clothing, the weapons -- any of the materials brought back from the Gulf War. I have reports from several different states where civilians that bought some of the clothing went home and wore them, and now the entire family is in wheel chairs; there have been some deaths as a result of this. The Resnick Interview with Peter Kawaja and Ex-NSA Agent Joe Jordan

Every Sephardi child was to be given 35,000 times the maximum dose of x-rays through his head. For doing so, the American government paid the Israeli government 300 million Israeli Liras a year. The entire Health budget was 60 million liras. The money paid by the Americans is equivalent to billions of dollars today. To fool the parents of the victims, the children were taken away on "school trips" and their parents were later told the x-rays were a treatment for the scourge of scalpal ringworm. 6,000 of the children died shortly after their doses were given, while many of the rest developed cancers that killed thousands over time and are still killing them now. While living, the victims suffered from disorders such as epilepsy, amnesia, Alzheimer's disease, chronic headaches and psychosis. ......The film presents a historian who first gives a potted history of the eugenics movement. In a later sound bite, he declares that the ringworm operation was a eugenics program aimed at weeding out the perceived weak strains of society. [August 19, 2004 Israel ] Ringworm and Radiation

To cause by means of limited wars in the advanced countries, by means of starvation and diseases in the Third World countries, the death of three billion people by the year 2050, people they call "useless eaters". The Committee of 300 (Illuminati) commissioned Cyrus Vance to write a paper on this subject of how to bring about such genocide. The paper was produced under the title "Global 2000 Report" and was accepted and approved for action by former President James Earl Carter, and Edwin Muskie, then Secretary of States, for and on behalf of the US Government. Under the terms of the Global 2000 Report, the population of the US is to be reduced by 100 million by the year of 2050. Targets of the Illuminati and the Committee of 300 By Dr. John Coleman

To bring about depopulation of large cities according to the trial run carried out by the Pol Pot regime in Cambodia. It is interesting to note that Pol Pot's genocidal plans were drawn up in the US by one of the Club of Rome's research foundations, and overseen by Thomas Enders, a high-ranking State Department official. It is also interesting that the committee is currently seeking to reinstate the Pol Pot butchers in Cambodia. Targets of the Illuminati and the Committee of 300 By Dr. John Coleman.

Society is being weeded out right now, as minority species are being eliminated very specifically by biological germ warfare and other tactics meant to insure the elimination of those less genetically favourable...Our food is being tampered with, by the insertion of food additives and substances like aspartame. ....They view this as a massive genetic clean up."--Thanks for the Memories: The Memoirs of Bob Hope's and Henry Kissinger's mind control slave by Brice Taylor.

It was not a large leap for a J.D. Rockefeller to go from owning the oil industry, the pharmaceutical industry, the banking industry etc. to wanting to own the whole world. This is the reason that Rockefeller and his foundation have been in the forefront of the population "control" and eugenics movement. Ultimately the goal is to reduce the earth's population for the simple warped reason that the less there is for you and me, the more there will be for J.D. and his cronies. The elite just loves birth control. Warren Buffet, Bill Gates, Ted Turner are among the ultra rich that have donated billions to spreading the gospel of contraception, abortion, and feminism using the United Nations and "US Aid." Rockefeller funded the invention of the pill, the IUD and owns the rights to the abortion drug RU-486. In the last 50 years, billions of public dollars have been spent on "family planning" designed to limit population by deceit and coercion, including compulsory abortion and infanticide. In "The War Against Population (1988)," Dr. Jacqueline Kasun writes that in 1981, a directory of population control agencies in Washington DC listed 92 private (but mostly publicly funded) agencies, 12 United Nations and 57 agencies of the US government (p. 198). "The real problem of government family planning is not one of families out of control but of planners out of control," she wrote (p.211). The Devil's Work: Feminism and the Elite Depopulation Agenda By Henry Makow Ph.D

It was the residential "schools" that constituted the death camps of the Canadian Holocaust, and within their walls nearly one-half of all aboriginal children sent there by law died, or disappeared, according to the government's own statistics.

These 50,000 victims have vanished, as have their corpses - "like they never existed", according to one survivor. But they did exist. They were innocent children, and they were killed by beatings and torture and after being deliberately exposed to tuberculosis and other diseases by paid employees of the churches and government, according to a "Final Solution" master plan devised by the Department of Indian Affairs and the Catholic and Protestant churches.

With such official consent for manslaughter emanating from Ottawa, the churches responsible for annihilating natives on the ground felt emboldened and protected enough to declare full-scale war on non-Christian native peoples through the 20th century.

The casualties of that war were not only the 50,000 dead children of the residential schools, but the survivors, whose social condition today has been described by United Nations human rights groups as that of "a colonized people barely on the edge of survival, with all the trappings of a third-world society". (November 12, 1999) HIDDEN FROM HISTORY - The Canadian Holocaust by Rev. Kevin D. Annett, MA, MDiv

Denis Halliday, who the previous year had resigned as assistant secretary general of the United Nations. He said: "We are waging a war through the United Nations on the people of Iraq. We're targeting civilians. Worse, we're targeting children. . . . What is this all about?".... he wrote, "because the policy of economic sanctions is . . . destroying an entire society. Five thousand children are dying every month. I don't want to administer a program that satisfies the definition of genocide."

Halliday's successor, Hans von Sponeck, another assistant secretary general with more than 30 years' service, also resigned in protest. ......Von Sponeck's disclosure that the sanctions restricted Iraqis to living on little more than $100 a year was not reported. "Deliberate strangulation," he called it. Neither was the fact that, up to July 2002, more than $5 billion worth of humanitarian supplies, which had been approved by the UN sanctions committee and paid for by Iraq, were blocked by George W. Bush, with Tony Blair's backing. They included food products, medicines and medical equipment, as well as items vital for water and sanitation, agriculture and education.

The cost in lives was staggering. Between 1991 and 1998, reported UNICEF, 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of five died. "If you include adults," said Halliday, "the figure is now almost certainly well over a million." The Media Culpability for Iraq By John Pilger

That`s all I have time for today.
 
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Roy-I give you a lot of credit for the amount of work/thought you obviously put in to your post:)

Thank you very much hunny ;). For now though I will put it on hold, my Father is now deep into stage 4 of Emphysema, he has lost around half his total body weight and needs an oxygen mask, he can do nothing more than lay on his sofa.

Once again tyvm.

Roy.
 
Thank you very much hunny ;). For now though I will put it on hold, my Father is now deep into stage 4 of Emphysema, he has lost around half his total body weight and needs an oxygen mask, he can do nothing more than lay on his sofa.

Once again tyvm.

Roy.

So sorry to hear that Roy, your father and family are in my thoughts and prayers.
 
Ty for your post Roy. I will not get into discussion right now, but I do follow closely and can say this; I do believe in the New World Order as so do millions of other people and until most wake up and realize what the motive and outcome will be, we are doomed.

Your welcome hun, I guess the average person just accepts world wars as part and parcel of being a human, a necessity that comes with the territory and the reason most countries need nuclear weapons, not many have researched all the conflicts from the past few hundred years or so, if they did/had they would notice an all to common similarity - Each and every war that resulted in the deaths of hundreds of millions can be attributed down to a handful of men, this has nothing to do with religion, well, I tell a lie, it has everything to do with religion, Christians are to blame for every single one, follow the trail of conflicts between Jews, Muslims, and you will find at the forefront the people who created the animosity, placed the tyrannical leaders in command and armed them.

How many countries would need an armed to the teeth military and an outrageously amount of nuclear overkill, if, world leaders had the ethics, doctrines, beliefs, morals and integrity, identical to such people as Martin Luther King, the Dalai Lama, and Ghandi?, to name just a few.

We stockpile arms and spend around 50% of our whole countries income on the military because governments tell us that we need to do that, if we removed every single warmonger leader from their respective countries, there would be world peace, it really is that simple.

I`m 100% certain that if there was a world poll asking people if they agree with wars and the deaths, carnage, heartbreak, ruined cities, hatred, injuries, they cause, only the raging psychopaths and politicians would say yes, the self same people who started the wars and sit safely at home, whilst millions of dads, husbands, brothers, sons, put their lives on the line, fighting for a cause that they actually believe in.
 
Thank you very much hunny ;). For now though I will put it on hold, my Father is now deep into stage 4 of Emphysema, he has lost around half his total body weight and needs an oxygen mask, he can do nothing more than lay on his sofa.

Once again tyvm.

Roy.

Thinking of you mate.

Hope that your Dad finds peace and comfort from his family in this difficult time, and that you know that you have many friends here at CM who will support you.
 
Thinking of you mate.

Hope that your Dad finds peace and comfort from his family in this difficult time, and that you know that you have many friends here at CM who will support you.

Thank you so much bud, life is the most precious thing on this planet, safeguarding our children`s future comes hand in hand with this, in these harrowing times it sickens me a whole heap more than normal, to see those who treat life with such contempt, disdain and disrespect.

Thanks.

Roy.
 
Thank you very much hunny ;). For now though I will put it on hold, my Father is now deep into stage 4 of Emphysema, he has lost around half his total body weight and needs an oxygen mask, he can do nothing more than lay on his sofa.

Once again tyvm.


Roy.


Roy I am very sorry to hear that. I have a LOT of empathy for what you are going through with your father. Just be there for him as long as you can.

Sending good thoughts/prayers for you both:)

**Just read Nifty's post-He is absolutely right that there are a lot of people here to support you in this!
 
Roy I am very sorry to hear that. I have a LOT of empathy for what you are going through with your father. Just be there for him as long as you can.

Sending good thoughts/prayers for you both:)

**Just read Nifty's post-He is absolutely right that there are a lot of people here to support you in this!

Thank you hunny, it`s very comforting to see all this support ;).
 
Until i`m in the right frame of mind, and add more stuff, some food for thought, what kind of society would see JFK, Martin Luther King, The Dalai Lama, John Lennon, Lady Diana, Rachel Corrie, Nelson Mandela, Lech Walesa, Malcolm X, and so many more, as a threat, when all they advocated, was world peace, an end to racial segregation, and solidarity?.



 
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"Ink fades, paper burns, words soon forgotten, but what is written in the soul, echoes in eternity."

Roy,words from the deepest part of the soul.

Thanks and so sorry for the pain that you are going through.

Thank you hunny, and I can be very deep sometimes, somewhere in the party thread is a link to a poem I wrote around 12 years ago, that is me at my deepest lol, you don`t go through life after suffering seven near death experiences along the way, without it having some sort of affect on your subconscious ;).
 
 
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The video seems to have been blocked or removed, although the information tab still works. Add this to your new world order theories.

Too late too, this matter was covered in one of those probing TV documentaries that the government sometimes shuts down with court orders. It was either Panorama or Dispatches, and it only served to make the Israelis look bad. If Israel keep this up, they will find non-Muslims supporting the Palestinian cause too.

Thanks for letting me know Brian, there will be other videos on youtube depicting this matter.

Ofc videos like this are a huge embarrassment for TPTB as they clearly show Muslim people for how they really are and not the crazy terrorists they want the world to believe they are, they want peace, like the rest of us.

It appears to me that the days of investigative journalism and in-depth documentaries are long gone, and with it the many world wide agencies that would probe cases of in-humanitarian acts, where are Amnesty International, Oxfam, UNICEF, the Red Cross, the NSPCC etcetera, and more importantly why are the MSM not reporting on these breeches of the Geneva Convention?......

(WARNING this link contains images that may cause distress to some people involving malformed babies due to radiation exposure......)

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This fucking sickens me to the core.

P.S.

That link still works for me.
 
I am not so sure about a single group being behind everything. It seems more like different groups of the rich and powerful getting together to influence individual governments, even key ministers and MPs. As they all have a common goal, fattening their own wallets and gaining power and influence, it can appear that all these groups act as one.

There is plenty of evidence for smaller groups of the rich and powerful influencing the path governments take, and it is common knowledge that MPs who "behave" when in office will land well paid "jobs" when their term ends, or they get kicked out by the voters. MPs who do what they are supposed to though, find it much harder to land on their feet when they leave office, and the powerful people they prod will resort to some dirty tricks to fool the voters into getting rid of them. MPs themselves get sucked in, and the recent expenses scandal revealed that an attitude that if there wasn't a law against it, it was OK, pervaded MP culture. This is the same principle that big companies use when finding new ways to rip off customers, yet the MPs are STILL buying into the idea that self regulation is good enough to control this, and big companies panic at the idea that MPs will pass formal regulations, rather than endorse self regulation.

Just look at how the big telecoms companies made a complete ass of OFCOM during the investigation of 0870 call charges, you could see it coming a mile off as they negotiated concessions that were then ruthlessly exploited as the loopholes they were always intended to be. It shows that those at OFCOM were either incredibly stupid, or being bribed or influenced by the companies they were supposed to be regulating. Bankers and Energy companies act the same, even the water companies are at it (Severn Trent even got done for fraud for giving fake figures to OFWAT to be granted a higher price increase). These are all separate groups, but their interests are the same - fatten their wallets and screw the customers.

When it comes to war, it is the arms and building sectors that benefit, one after the other. Fortunes were to be made in Iraq. Arms companies made the bombs, then the oil and building companies started bidding for the rebuilding contracts. These were all US companies, and intended to be entrenched before Iraq could build up local expertise. This means that the US companies will make the profits, with very little staying in a post war Iraq, who's people will remain poor for some time after peace is established. The instability this causes will of course keep the arms and security companies in work.
 

The way I see it - No leader of any country would put his whole country`s lives at stake unless it was the only viable action to take, a brief breakdown of WWII.....

1). Germany invades Poland, Churchill declares war against Germany knowing damn well if this wasn`t a pre-planned event they would have decimated us.

2). Hitler`s next course of action beggar`s belief, instead of invading us and nipping our intervention in the bud, he decides the next best course of action is to declare war against Russia and in doing so starts the mind boggling stretching of his forces.

3). Japan for some bizarre reason joins in, a country made up of a few islands in the Pacific Ocean somehow feels threatened, a perfect target to test the world`s 1st atomic bombs don`t you think?, all America needs is a reason to use them, and boom, their status as the most powerful country in the world is in the bag.

4). Japan stick to the plan perfectly as they set forth on a surprise attack against the Americans at Pearl harbour, even though the Americans are forewarned of this incoming fleet by both Australian and British intelligence forces, they decide the best option is to completely ignore this and basically sign the death warrants of thousands of unsuspecting military personnel sunbathing, the other kicker here is - at this time America was not at war against Japan, however, we were, why didn`t the allied forces attack the fleet instead of standing off and letting them butcher all those men?.

5). Hitler`s Holocaust is in full swing ensuring the whole world loathes him as his barbaric treatment of the Jews starts to filter out, such is his hatred of the Jews there are many Jewish Nazi`s and several are officers in his Gestapo:confused:.

6). Over in Russia, Stalin is doing his bit for depopulation by committing genocide to the tune of around 25 million of his own people.

7). Back in America the tills are ringing nicely, as Bush Sr and Rockefeller ensure the cash needed to fund both the Bush`s political dynasty and the Rockefeller`s banking domination will be easily met, courtesy of selling arms and munitions to both the Germans and the allied forces.

8), Word is also breaking out of the horrendous conditions that the British POW (both male and female) are being subjected to.

9). Hitler`s troops are now so spread around the world his officers are beginning to think he has gone completely mad, and start to question his real motives, after the war these officers will have many stories to tell.

10). Even though the British Air Force is completely outnumbered by the Luftwaffe, we once again defy all odds and fight them off.

11). The world gasps in awe as the outrageous cowardly attack on Pearl Harbour spreads.

12). America takes charge of the Allied landings and begins the onslaught with night time bombing raids of the coastal defences around Normandy, thus ensuring the safety of the Engineers whom will be landing 1st to clear the beaches etcetera, in preparation for the allied invasion.

13). The 1st units arrive at their designated beaches expecting some resistance, they are absolutely decimated as it soon becomes apparent that the Germans are at full strength and barely scratched, the bombing raids had somehow managed to miss the entire coastal defences and dropped most of their bombs around 20 miles inland, and easy mistake to make, as it`s almost impossible to notice when sea becomes land, as water is wet and a fluid, and land is, in this case - sand.

14). America feel now is the time to unleash the real reason and cause for WWII on the unsuspecting islands of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

15). Japan duly surrender.

16). Secret services once again are prevented to take Hitler out via a sniper.

17). Hitler commits suicide but his body is never found.

18). Before his officers have time to express their findings regarding Hitler`s erratic decisions, they are all executed for war crimes, bar a few that end up spending several years in Spandau prison, and the elite scientists that are taken back to America.

19). British POW are liberated by the Americans and on their return journey are made to sign the official secrets act regarding their ill treatment by the Japanese guards, because tainting the reputation of Japan would jeopardise future trading amongst them and other countries.

20). No Japanese soldiers were tried for war crimes, other than Tojo and six officers, after being found guilty by a one man prosecutor, unlike the Nuremburg trials where there were 4, the prosecutor was American Joseph B. Keenan, a former assistant to the U.S. attorney.

21). Neither was Stalin.

22). Behind closed doors, the profits were shared between the participating countries leaders, as the real world started to pay the price, the cash needed to buy the presidency, and every other world leadership is in the bag, the depopulation figures were well above the target, thanks to the ethnic cleansing services put in by both Stalin and Hitler, a special thanks to Emperor Hirohito also, for offering the services of his country as test site for the Atomic bombs, and in doing so, contributed nicely to the depopulation target.
 
International bankers and WWII


The Treaty of Versailles, signed at the end of WWI, was designed to rip off Germany, to further consolidate the control of international bankers over USA and Europe, and to lay the basis of the next world war so that the agenda of establishment of a one world government could be carried further. The League of Nations was set up after WWI and the UN was set up after WWII. The UN building was a “gift” from the Rockefeller`s! Supranational bodies, like the UN, IMF, etc, will eventually become the basis of one world government by gradually encroaching over national autonomy. The national governments will gradually be rendered powerless and impotent. WWI had added incredible sums to the coffers of the international bankers, who began setting up privately controlled central banks on the pattern of the Bank of England and the US Federal Reserve. Rothschild had once said: “Give me control over a nation’s money and I care not who makes its laws.”

Taking over the central banks of nations has been one of the most crucial elements in the strategy of international bankers over the past two centuries to bring about a New World Order. In his book, Pawns in the Game, Guy Carr wrote: “Since the great war, the international bankers had set up 26 central banks.” As WWI had been successfully managed with unprecedented profits and unprecedented control of the elite over nations, the next world war would lead much further to the goal of one world government.

To bring about the next world war both Soviet Russia and Germany were developed by the banking elite and then a clash brought about between them. The British government, which has been under the control of the bankers after Waterloo, which made Rothschild the undisputed master of English money line, always does their bidding. The US had come under deeper and enduring control of the bankers because of the privately owned Federal Reserve and WWI, which was to be used to bring about the desired result.

In his ground-breaking books, Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution, and Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler, Anthony Sutton has completely exposed the heinous intrigues being enacted remorselessly and ceaselessly by the hidden elite. Sutton’s works are among the works of many highly distinguished authors in the West, particularly USA, which, while exposing the repugnant and absolutely inhuman effort of the elite to control human life and to destroy it whenever needed, have been assiduously ignored by the mainstream publishers as well as the mainstream media. The media and the publishers are controlled by the elite and work entirely for the promotion and protection of its interests. Hollywood too is part of creating a mental matrix of deception designed to be-fool and mesmerise mankind and lead it to complete subjugation by the elite.

Germany was rearmed with the deep and concealed assistance of the Wall Street and its controllers, some of whom resided, and still reside, outside the US. To quote Sutton: “The contribution made by American capitalism to German war preparations before 1940 can only be described as phenomenal. It was certainly crucial to German military capabilities.” It has been remarked that without the chemical giant I.G. Farben, there would be no WWII. The giant chemical industry, which sustained German war effort, was set up in 1926 with money from Wall Street bankers. The German I.G. Farben had Max Warburg as its Director and its American Director was his brother Paul Warburg, the hidden author of the Federal Reserve Act.


Further evidence is found in a report of a Senate Subcommittee on War Mobilisation and Military Affairs (Kilgore Committee): “The Germans were brought to Detroit to learn the techniques of specialised production of components, and of straight-line assembly…….The techniques learned in Detroit were eventually used to construct dive-bombing Stukka`s.” Sutton writes: “According to Hitler’s financial genie, Hjalmar Horace Greeley Schacht and Nazi industrialist Fritz Thyssen, it was the 1928 Young Plan, formulated by Morgan agent Owen D. Young, that brought Hitler to power in 1933.”

That the international bankers built the Soviet Union is established by documented records. The Bolshevik Revolution not only destroyed the Czar, it created a monopoly in Soviet business controlled by the international bankers. Lenin and Trotsky were both agents of the bankers, as has been established by several authors. Marx was also financed by Wall Street! All Soviet business went to the world’s wealthiest families, most of whom were unwelcome in Czarist Russia.
However, as written by Guy Carr: “Hitler antagonised the international bankers when he announced his financial policy……. The German Reich abrogated the clause in the Constitution, which made Dr Hans Luther, the President of Reichsbank, a permanent fixture. Until the change was made, the President of Reichsbank could not be removed without his own consent and a majority vote of the Board of the Bank of International settlements.”

The entry of the US in WWII was pre-planned and was made possible by the manipulated Pearl Harbour attack, which aroused the indignation of the US public. That the entire attack was the result of pre-planned provocation has been exposed irrefutably and with absolute clarity on the basis of the documents uncovered by Robert Stinnett under the Freedom of Information Act. The war was prolonged by various tactics and the allied forces allowed the Russians to capture East Europe deliberately. Thus, the two new powers that emerged were the Soviet Union and USA, both under the control of international bankers. The basis of a new managed conflict, the so-called cold war between capitalism and communism was laid by the banking cabal.

In WWII, the fatalities are estimated to be between 62 to 78 million, 10 times the number killed during WWI. According to a writer, over 2.5 percent of the human population of the planet was killed. When Churchill learned of the brutal allied bombing on Rotterdam he remarked: “Unrestricted submarine warfare, unrestricted air bombing - this is total war……. Time and Ocean and some guiding star and High Cabal have made us what we are.” The High Cabal is the perpetual hidden and lethal enemy of mankind.
 
Okay, where were we?, ah yes, central banking, depopulation, the need of armed forces, and ofc - reasons why we need to spend over 50% of the entire national budgets on the military. In days long gone by the enemy at the door was neither religion based nor an enemy whose form of attack was based on stealth and surprise - The Terrorist, creating a religious based war against fellow Christians would not have worked and got the public backing that all wars need, instead, the early wars were started by Christians with different social ethics and ideals - Communists and Fascists, this worked perfectly for both WW1-WWII, even though WWI was initiated by a false flag event (more on those later).

The main reason many people do not believe in secret societies and their objectives is "But how would a few people have such control over the armed forces, the Main Stream Media (MSM), and constantly pull the wool over the general public eyes?", I will cover all these reasons as this thread matures, although all three aspects are easily answered.......

1). The military`s key objectives are to serve, protect, and obey, these are the people I really feel for, along with 1st responders, like the 300+ firemen, policemen, 1st aiders that were murdered by their own government in New York 11/09/2001, even though this false flag event is part and parcel of the bigger picture I will refrain as best I can from using it in this thread.

I have covered some aspects of it in my symbolism thread, if people still have doubts I can very easily add at least another 20-30 pages of irrefutable evidence backed up by scientific/physics/experts in the field/videos/eye witness testimonies/ 1st hand accounts from airline pilots with over 5000 hours experience explicitly detailing why it was impossible for all 4 of those planes that day, to have done what they done, this angle is also covered by licensed structural engineers/architects and ex serviceman including those that have worked in the fields of espionage and counter terrorist units, the evidence is overwhelming, I could quite easily supply around 100 pages of evidence proving beyond reasonable doubt it did not happen that way, all I ask in return is at least one page of evidence supporting the official story, i`m still waiting. Anyhow, back to the plot.

People join the armed forces for the 3 main reasons I gave above, they do not join to murder innocent people because their Presidents/Prime ministers tell them to (even though some of the videos I have posted prove otherwise - disturbing), so, the answer here is simple, have units prepared to do the dirty work for you that ask no questions, it`s all about the chain of command, follow this chain to right up to the top, where does it end?.

The military also has backing from the more sinister and fear inducing secret services (alphabet agencies), these have the add-on affect of silencing those who question the TPTB (The Powers That Be) or, more importantly could expose certain aspects if cases go to trial
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So, in the nutshell - You do not need to brainwash the servicemen to do your dirty work, just send the orders down the CoC that we are at war, it`s time to go to work.

2). Controlling the MSM and thus having the best propaganda tool out there as far as painting a completely different picture goes, this aspect has the added bonus of 3 other ways to fool the public - History Channels, Hollywood, Newspapers, there are only 5 ways to have known how something happened - Observe it 1st hand, see it on the news, read about it in the papers, for older events - Watch a documentary about it on the History channel, or a blockbuster movie about it, governments own a vast majority of news channels including the largest gatherer of world news in the world - The B.B.C. (go to youtube and type in B.B.C. broadcasts collapse of WTC7 20 minutes before it collapses) Although it is state owned, however, the BBC Trust run it on their behalf to guarantee its impartiality.

It`s a well known fact that the hierarchy of the Illuminati are high ranking Zionist Jews, how many Hollywood film producers are of Jewish decent?, not all Hollywood producers are in the Illuminati, all the films that show Illuminati based symbolism from the last 20 years or so, show a sign of being related to 9/11.

Governments in general portray a completely different picture of what is going on in the world, to what is actually going on, no film depicted this better than The Matrix, i`m not saying that we all live in a computer generated Matrix and have sockets built in to us, but to look deeper into the film for it`s true hidden meaning, (how many of you have read George Orwell`s Animal Farm?, a book detailing life on a farm through the eyes of animals, it`s true meaning is based on Communism), anyhow, back to the film The Matrix, let`s see if we can find some Illuminati-9/11 related symbolism in it.......



I will also leave to you some simple research, see if you can find a link to a huge world wide MSM company that also owns other channels related to what I have stated above, and the man behind it.

3). This aspect I will be covering in-depth in my next post which entails a huge amount of videos, pictures, news events etcetera.

I will finish off this post with more on false flag events, if, we had a true enemy there would be no reason to create fake events that lead to war, would there?

Irrefutable and of as yet technically proven to be true, but evidence wise, substantially proven beyond reasonable doubt to be true False Flag Events......

The leaders of smaller and less industrialised nations are not madmen (whatever the media claims). They also are generally better informed than their citizens. In a war an attacker does not need equal forces compared to the enemy. The attacker needs a 5-fold local superiority, or better. No one begins wars without very definite objectives and a quick victory in sight. If a war with more even military balance erupts, someone has been mislead and walked into a trap (usually arranged by third party).

1605 - The infamous Guy Fawkes plot to blow up the English Parliament. Actually an institutional false flag plot used as a pretext for war with Spain. Official history still repeats this deception.

After the American war of Independence (1776-1779), and an English challenge to that independence (1812-1814) no single nation has planned an offensive war against the USA. It is probable that a strong coalition of Anglo-French-led European nations planned to split the USA into two states through diplomatic recognition of the Confederate states possibly followed up by naval blockade embargoing the Union. At that time the British Empire was the strongest naval power, and the French the second strongest. The events led, however, into the Civil War (1860-1865) and due to the Russian intervention 1863 (1863) on the Union's side, those European plans were quietly abandoned.

Mexican wars 1819, 1846-48: Long series of operations, commencing with the annexation of Florida (1819) and followed by a declaration of independence of Texas from Mexico (1836). Provocative troop movements near the U.S. southern border caused an incident which led to war. (It is said the US built a fortification 150 km inside the Mexican border.) The annexation of Texas by the USA and the conquest of California, New Mexico, and nearby territories followed. Mexico had a weak government at that time, because after Napoleon conquered Spain (1809) their former colonies soon revolted. Mexico had been a colony of the Spanish kingdom but now they revolted and formed a republic. There were a series of revolts, not just one.

Spanish-American war, 1898: The surprise explosion of the battleship Maine at Havana, Cuba. 255 of the crew died. The Hearst press accused the Spanish, claiming that the explosion was caused by a remote-controlled mine. The USA declared war on Spain, and conquered Philippines, Guam and Cuba. Subsequent investigations revealed that the explosion originated inside the Maine and that it was either an accident, such as a coal explosion, or some type of time bomb inside the battleship. Divers investigating the shipwreck found that the armour plates of the ship were blown bending outwards, not inwards.

1933 - The Reichstag Fire allows the Nazis to crack down on their opposition and take power. A naked cowering Dutch communist, Martin Van der Lubbe, is found on the scene and the Nazis immediately claim that the fire is a communist plot.

“The exact sequence of events will never be known, but Nazi storm troopers under the direction of Hermann Göring were also involved in torching the place. They had befriended the arsonist and may have known or even encouraged him to burn the Reichstag that night. The storm troopers, led by SA leader Karl Ernst, used the underground tunnel that connected Göring’s residence with the cellar in the Reichstag. They entered the building, scattered gasoline and incendiaries, then hurried back through the tunnel.”


World War I, 1914-1918: A U-boat torpedo hit ocean liner Lusitania near Britain and some 1200 people, including 128 Americans, on board lost their lives. Subsequent investigations revealed that the major explosions were inside the Lusitania, as it was secretly transporting 6 million pounds of artillery shells and rifle ammunition, as well as other explosives on behalf of Morgan banking corporation to help their clients, the Britain and the France. It was against US laws to transport war materials and passengers in the same ship.

World War 2, 1939-1945: A U-boat torpedo hit the ocean liner Athena near Britain with some 1100 passengers, of which 311 were Americans. The sea was calm and only 118 people on board lost their lives. The ship was sunk because it behaved like a military transport, blackened out and zigzagging. This incident wasn't enough to precipitate war, and the Germans also refused to be provoked by several American acts of war. Americans confiscated German merchant ships, and Americans started to support the British with various lend-lease items, US volunteer pilots joined the RAF and some RAF pilots were trained in the US, US gave the British 50 old but usable WW1 destroyers and 20 modern torpedo boats, tanks, light bombers, fighter aircraft like P-40s and so on. American destroyers also escorted the convoys bound to Britain, and attacked German U-boats even far away from those convoys. The US did not maintain a neutral stance attitude towards the warring nations.

The US naval intelligence, chief of Japan desk planned and suggested "8 insults", which should bring Japan into war with the US. President Roosevelt executed this plan immediately and also added some other insults, enraging the Japan. The most serious one was a total blockade of Japanese oil imports, as agreed between the Americans, British and the Dutch. FDR also declared an all-out embargo against the Japan and forbade them the use of Panama canal, impeding Japan's access to Venezuelan oil.

The Flying Tigers volunteer air group successfully fighting the Japanese in China with some 90 fairly modern P-40Bs was another effective provocation that is not generally acknowledged by historical accounts of World War 2, most of which fail to mention any air combat action prior to 7th December 1941. But at that time the Japanese had already had lost about 100 military aircraft, mostly bombers, to the Tigers. After Pearl Harbour these squadrons were some of the the hardest-hitting ones in the US service.

The attack on Pearl Harbour followed some 6 months later. Having broken the Japanese encryption codes, the Americans knew what was going to happen, when and where, but the president did not dispatch this information to Pearl Harbor. Americans even gave their friends the British 3 Magic decrypting machines which automatically opened encrypted Japanese military traffic. But this same information was not available to the commanders of Hawaii. The movement of the fleet was also visible in the very effective radio direction finding network. Japan had an alliance with Germany, and the Germans upheld their promises by declaring the war against the USA right after the Japanese declaration.

Two scapegoats, the navy commander Admiral Husband Kimmel, and the army commander Lt. General Walter Short were found incompetent and demoted as they were allowed to retire. Short died 1949 and Kimmel 1958. In 1995, the US Congress re-examined this decision and endorsed it. Then in 2000 some archive information came to light and the US Senate passed a resolution stating that both had served in Hawaii "competently and professionally". In 1941 they were denied vital information, and even on presidential orders purposefully mislead into believing that the Japanese feet could be expected from the south west. These commanders have yet to be rehabilitated by the Pentagon.


After World War II, Operation Gladio was a “stay behind” operation by NATO, CIA, and MI6 to counter communist/leftist influence in Europe. These state-sponsored “secret armies” used false flag terrorism.

Korean War, 1950-1953: South Korean incursions (the Tiger regiment etc.) into North Korea (1949) led to contrary claims and into war. The cause of this war probably was covert action involving leaders of Taiwan, South Korea and the US military-industrial complex (John Foster Dulles has been mentioned as an organizer of the hostilities.) After the unpublished hostilities in 1949, the communist powers were strongly backing North Korea.

Chiang Kai Sek was being abandoned, isolated and falling prey to the powerful communist Chinese operations. The right-wing South Korean ruler was expected to loose the soon-to-be-elections. The American military-industrial complex went into high gear again, and huge government orders for equipment were flowing in.

The American-led UN forces had difficult times early in the war, but after sufficient forces arrived they advanced victoriously and penetrated deep into the North Korea. The strong Chino-Russian intervention into the war once again turned the tides, the Chinese with vast armies on ground, and the Soviets less visibly with large numbers of aircraft, nearly costing the UN forces the war.

Finally the front stabilised along the original 38th parallel armistice line. The war resulted in the death of 3 million Korean Chinese and the destruction of virtually all of the Korean cities, and left Taiwan in strong American protection and South Korea firmly in the hands of the right-wing president Syngman Rhee. Some 55,000 Americans lost their lives.

1954 - The Lavon Affair, a “scandal over a failed Israeli covert operation in Egypt known as Operation Suzannah, in which U.S. and U.K. targets in Egypt were bombed and evidence left implicating the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood; a textbook example of a false flag operation.”

Vietnam War: "The Tonkin incident", where American destroyer Maddox was supposedly attacked twice by three North Vietnamese torpedo boats in 1964 in the Gulf of Tonkin never happened. What was happening at the time were aggressive South Vietnamese raids against the North in the same general area. Huge American presence wasn't decisive and President Nixon negotiated a "peace with honour" in 1973. This war was lost, when North Vietnam finally conquered South Vietnam in 1975.

Grenada invasion: The Grenadian leader, Maurice Bishop, favouring the left and having invited Cubans to help build the infrastructure including by extending the airport to accommodate long range Soviet aircraft, was deposed and executed in October 19, 1983. Six days later the US invaded, with the proffered reason that the American medical students studying in the Grenada were in danger due the Cuban presence. The new leader supported by the US favoured more traditional values and the right.

War on Drugs: The war was launched by Richard M Nixon sometime around June 17,1971. The drug problem was found bad within the army in Viet Nam around 1968 prompting action was required towards the end of the war. Nowadays it is estimated that the military will never win the War on Drugs. The street prices of illicit drugs did not change significantly in the USA despite the military action in foreign drug-producing countries. The Colombian experience, with local military supported by the US, has shown that peace is more important than war against drugs. The Colombians have successfully negotiated some 1000s of guerilla fighters back into the society and out of jungle.

This "war" actually seems to be a pretext for military invasions into less developed countries, where covert "bad" drug lords on behalf of western intelligence services are producing drugs into US and first world markets. This operation produces huge incomes, generating black budget money for those intelligence services managing the global drug operations.

Panama invasion: The incident between American and Panamanian troops led to invasion. The leader Noriega was changed and the earlier Carter administration plan to hand control of the canal over to Panama was cancelled. The strategic importance of the canal has surpassed any more just thinking in the US global domination policy.

US-Israeli sponsored war between Iraq and Iran, 1980-1988: The US has built power bases in the Middle East in Iran starting with the CIA-organised coup 1953, where Iranian prime minister Mossadeq was replaced with the Shah of Iran Reza Pahlavi and he by his son Mohammad Reza Pahlavi. Iran was equipped with the best western military equipment, including the American F-14 fighters with Phoenix missiles and the British Chieftain MBTs. Unfortunately there was in 1979 a coup of ayatollah Khomeini replacing the Shah and founding an Islamite nation.

After this, the US warmed up relations with their good Iraqi friend Saddam Hussein, and started to build a nation capable of challenging the Iran. Iraq acquired large numbers of effective weapons including factories able to produce older versions of gas warfare agents. These would later be called WMD`s, which of course they were not, being the WW1-vintage weapons.

The war broke out and was fought to exhaustion because third-party powers, especially Israel, were carefully monitoring the power balance supplying more weapons to the side which seemed to be loosing. "Too bad they both cannot loose" is how Kissinger evaluated this situation.

Desert Storm (First Gulf war), 1991): Hussein asked for permission from the US (via their ambassador April Gillespie) and got an answer that the US does not care Arab quarrels. That was a trap, and after Saddam occupied Kuwait, George Bush Sr. mobilised a coalition of some 40 nations to "liberate Kuwait" and to smash the recently-built Iraqi military power base. This also involved a media hoax, where the daughter of Kuwaiti US ambassador played nurse on TV and testified to "witnessing" Iraqi soldiers throwing babies out of incubators in Kuwait.

War on Terror: The war was launched by Bush administration October 2001. The war was claimed to be the response on terrorism, especially the 9-11 incidents. Most of the people in the world today know that these reasons are false and that those events were based on MIH type (make it happen) inside job.

Enduring Freedom (Afghanistan invasion), 7.10.2001-: Without any evidence, the former CIA-asset, a Saudi-Arabian Osama bin Laden was claimed to be the mastermind behind the 9/11 strikes at the WTC and the Pentagon. Such a complex operation, if actually executed which it was not, in this case would be much beyond the capabilities of anything in Afghanistan. Only some top ten intelligence services in the world could hope to be successful in such an operation involving forgery, infiltration, living "underground" in a foreign non-Muslim country, coordination of moves, illegal arms, hi-quality flight training, accurate aircraft navigation in no-visibility conditions and so on. Perhaps even less, because the friends of the US (at that time, still most of the world) would also have been interested in stopping the attack.

Enduring Justice (Second Gulf war), 20.3.2003-: later known with less irony as Operation Iraqi Freedom The claimed reason of the attack was that Iraq was a clear and present danger to the US with wmd's available within less than an hour after the decision to assemble them has been made. Since no wmd's were found, and after the Iraqi also scrapped some 800 long range Scud style missiles before the US coalition attack, the reason for the invasion was changed into "bringing the democracy into Iraq".


Well, that`s it for today :).
 
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Seventh, may your father have peace and comfort during this difficult time.


I'm convinced you're either Ron Paul or former member RobWin :p As you may know there have been threads here before regarding 9/11 CT's. Not to waste your time but.....NatGeo Channel among others have conducted exhaustive research on 9/11 CT's and havn't find an ounce of truth to any of it (although the molten metal/Newton's 3rd Law arguments are compelling).

For those of us that are trying to follow your logic and want to check your sources, could you give credit to the original author when you post? Or did I miss it? Most of your first post was posted on Ron Paul's site years ago.

Thanks,
Bryan
 
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OK i'm of few words but here is my take on this

1- we all have had privy to its coming

2 - where in the scriptures

3- real believers can indore thru it ,but the rest will Nash there teeth as is written

i am by no means a model of religious following i will ask for redempton for i am human

my deepest thoughts are stop struggling with it we weren't supposed to know or it would be innate to us

peace to the world- RC
 

Who's struggling? For me its just intellectual stimulation.

But if you find a passage that deals with the minimum temperature for certain metal alloys to melt, please let us know!
 
Who's struggling? For me its just intellectual stimulation.

But if you find a passage that deals with the minimum temperature for certain metal alloys to melt, please let us know!

weill this is a quote , and by no means was my statement meant to or for you but it was meant for all those people that might find value in it
peace be with you [and nobody is getting off the planet to live [alive ] in there present form again i say peace your friend don
 

Lol i`m neither, most of the quotes in my 1st post have the authors with them, the rest is mine, like I stated previously i`m trying to keep 9/11 out of this thread, I have another thread (The Symbolism thread with loads of 9/11 related stuff in it) as far as debunking 9/11 CT`s goes i`ve seen various state owned channels pump out a half hearted attempt with none of the various branches of the truth movement there - Architects/engineers for truth, Pilots for truth, 1st responders for truth, Veterans for truth (ex/still serving high ranking servicemen including espionage and counter terrorist personnel) Barristers/lawyers for truth, the list is endless, now, if, the TPTB want to lay this ghost to rest then why not invite members from all these movements to put forward their evidence and findings.

A few years ago Mythbusters "debunked" the use of thermite on vertical steels stating it could not be securely held in place long enough to melt through girders, so an independent guy created a simple device proving Mythbusters wrong,




So here we have state run channels broadcasting predetermined outcomes.
 
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Roy I'm seriously impressed, I have researched all of what you have posted in your initial post for ages, it sickens me also, and how the most richest people in the world attend a meeting in secret, (bielderburg group) now this in itself raises ALOT of questions, what topics be discussed in meetings such as this one, where they meet every year in different destinations?:confused:

Here is a video of an interview about Bohemian grove


Alot of the rich and powerful attend this place to take part in a ritual, where they worship an owl (Molech) and do a mock sacrifice to burn away their care of 'The People' *note: alot of presidents have taken part in this ritual.

Have you researched about the council of 300 yet?
 
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Hey hun, long time no see:(, no I haven`t researched the council of 300 yet hun, I also haven`t mentioned the feeder secret society for the Illuminati - Skull and Bones.

I would love to see the day they "Debunk 9/11 CT`s" on yet another channel owned by Rupert Murdoch :rolleyes:, and invite along the likes of these guys.....

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About time the world took a deep long look at the evidence available regarding 9/11 and the sheer physics of it all, proving beyond doubt it was an inside job, and removed from power those involved, what people have to get their heads around 1st for this to happen is - The leaders of the countries involved in the New World Order do not give a flying fuck about their nations people, all you are to them are Useless Eaters that pay the taxes that finance their long time plan.

Establish this (especially amongst the military) and we`re good to go, one day, just one day, a high ranking officer will sit down and research WWI-WWII and think "Hold on a minute", The Treaty of Versailles is almost a Hollywood script for the onset of WWII, a handful of men can be attributed down to the loss of 78 million deaths, a seemingly mental tyrannical despot stretching his forces around the world as far as possible, poor military decisions resulting in heavy losses, battles won by the sheer underdog beating gigantic odds against them, the involvement of Japan and the end result, turning a blind eye to any other race than the Germans regarding war crimes, Churchill and Stalin`s erratic behaviour after WWII (Incinerating places that would have held many clues regarding the Holocaust in general), the pre-arranged trading for Japan involving many countries, enforced by ordering the survivors of the Japanese PoW`s having to sign the official secrets act regarding the treatment of them by the Japanese guards, no man tells it better
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So, for those who find it impossible that a handful of men/woman could have that much control, and in doing so, create world wars that do both - Depopulate, generate vast wealth, think again - 78 million deaths - a handful of men - 78 million deaths.

How much evidence do you need/want?.
 
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The problem is this, people are so transfixed on what they see on telly (conditionally programmed to dismiss all of this) they would rather watch a nonsense fictional soap every bloody day and talk about that, than to talk about REAL issues, including issues that have brought the recession into place, attacking world trade, by creating 9/11.

Dr Eric pianka was gave a standing ovation at a seminar when he said that half the population should be wiped out (not necessarily in them exact words).

Big Pharma don't want people to be healthy, they NEED a revenue for their drug manufacturing, don't even get me started on vaccines,

I'll give you the name of a video to watch, a lot of videos actually, Type Robert Menard freeman on the land into Youtube and watch his vids, it will open your eyes, this man had his kid TOOK off him, he studied the law to get custody of her and won, but only after 5 years.
THEY told him that she would go through foster home to foster home before he got her back, the bastards! He had done nothing wrong to her.
 

They have done their utmost to keep world morale at low levels, one aspect they never catered for in early days planning was the internet, getting control of the media in general, including the film industry, would have meant a nigh on 100% control over what is watched or read in the papers. We all know how factually wrong Hollywood is when pumping out a new film. Film`s/Books based on true events in History are the only way possible to know of the past, and in watching them we are led to believe the content in them, this in turn leads to the opinions/views/overall perception of the relative historical event depicted in the film, of those that watch them, when these events are of significant historical importance, people`s assessments based on their beliefs have been judged courtesy of a misinformation riddled film, and therefore way off the mark, let`s take Braveheart for eg.



The opening scenery is from the West Highlands, an area not at the centre of, or even particularly involved in, Wallace's risings against Edward. (The rest of Scotland does not look anything like the West Highlands, nor did it circa 1300. The appearance of West Highlands are as distinctive compared to the rest of Scotland as the appearance of the Grand Canyon is compared to the rest of America, so this is like using aerial shots of the Grand Canyon in Arizona as the "scene setting" opening shots of a movie about the American War of Independence.)

As the content of the film will eventually make clear, the narrator/film doesn't actually tell us of William Wallace. Instead, it tells of us some fantasy character in a fantasy world who coincidentally share's Wallace's name.

It is the historians from Scotland, far more than from England, who will recognize the errors of the narrator/film.

History is written by the literate, be they victors or vanquished, whether they have hanged heroes or followed them. In the case of Scotland, plenty of it has been written by Scots, including medieval Scots who opposed English overlord-ship and modern Scots opposed to union with England.

In 1280, the King of Scotland (Alexander III) was not only not dead, but both of his two sons were also alive and well. The younger son, David, didn't die until 1281, the eldest son, Alexander, didn't die until 1284, and King Alexander himself didn't die until two years after that. (Alexander also had at least one living daughter in 1280, Margaret, who didn't die until 1283.)

Even when Kind Alexander III did die in 1286, with no surviving sons, he left a granddaughter, Margaret, who was acknowledged as his heir by the Scottish nobles and even the King of England, who negotiated with Scotland to marry her to his son and heir. Rather than fighting each other over the crown, the Scots appointed guardians who ruled the realm in her name for four years, until she died in 1290 while on her way to Scotland.

But even at this point, the nobles did not fall into civil war, and Edward I of England did not claim the throne of Scotland for himself. Instead, they held a court case to determine who was the rightful heir. While Edward did claim overlord-ship of Scotland, did preside over the court case, and undoubtedly influenced the conclusion, the end result was to pick (in 1292) John Balliol as King of Scotland by what we and contemporary and subsequent medieval Scots would consider quite normal rules of primogeniture of males of like degree. (In other words, they picked the right guy according to the rules.)

King John ruled until 1296, when he was forced to abdicate (after going to war with England due to opposition to such things as Edward's "cruel" insistence on hearing appeals of Scottish court cases in England and due to the Scottish nobles not wanting to be made to fight for England in foreign wars). Then, and only then, did Edward I claim to rule Scotland directly himself instead of installing a new Scottish king.

So, in fact, there had been no actual armed conflict between Scotland and England in this period until King John Balliol's short lived "rebellion" in 1296 and it was not until this year that Edward, after a fashion, claimed the Scottish crown for himself. Note that is 16 years later than the film's false "1280", and, significantly, just the year before the real Wallace's uprising in 1297. [Keep this in mind for all later scenes showing or referring to the supposed long-endured "oppression" of Scotland by England -- that's a good chunk of the movie false in all aspects right there.]

Edward I was a Christian. He was in no sense a "pagan" -- there had not been any true pagans in Britain since the end of the Viking era centuries earlier. (He wasn't even a "Paganus" in the much earlier Classical Latin sense of "peasant" or "yokel".)

In the 13th century (and the 14th, 15th, and most of the 16th), no Scots, whether Gaels or not, wore belted plaids (let alone kilts of any kind). Further, when the Scottish Gaels did start wearing their belts outside their plaids (mantles), they did not wear them in the rather bizarre style depicted in the film. In other words, not only did the film get the clothing wrong, but they got the wrong clothing itself wrong! (This is like a film about Colonial America showing the colonial men wearing 20th century business suits, but with the jackets worn back-to-front instead of the right way around.)

Many, perhaps even most, of the nobles of Scotland, especially those involved in the wars with England, were not Gaels, but rather were culturally similar to English nobles. These Scottish nobles, and also many lesser land holders, would have dressed more or less like their English counterparts, many of whom were their relatives, and spoken a Scottish dialect of English and/or Anglo-Norman French, again like the English nobles. Such were the families of Wallace, Bruce, Balliol, Murray, Stewart, Douglas, Comyn, and many others.

To the best of my knowledge, at no time did Edward invite the nobles of Scotland "to talks of truce -- no weapons, one page only." Certainly not in 1280, when Alexander III had his nobles well in hand, nor in 1286, nor 1290, nor 1292, nor 1296. Especially he would not have called them to such talks in Glen Nevis or anywhere that looked remotely like Glen Nevis, far from Edward's strongholds and power. (Again, this is like depicting discussions between the Colonial Americans and British as taking place in the Grand Canyon.)

Although the name of William Wallace's father was not really known (at the time the movie was made), what was known was that he was no mere "farmer". He was a knight who held lands.

William Wallace also had at least two brothers, Malcolm and John. Malcolm was the eldest and although it is not clear when their father died, by 1296 Malcolm was a knight himself holding lands in Elderslie. So that's a minimum of three sons, not two, at least in 1296. How many sons Wallace's father had in 1280 is anybody's guess! [Note for future reference that at least one of William's brothers, Sir John Wallace, outlived him, and his brother Sir Malcolm may have as well.]

The valley where Wallace's home is shown to be is also in the West Highlands, not the area (Elderslie and the parish of Paisley) nor even at all like the area from which Wallace actually hailed (or at least where his brother held lands and he very likely hailed). It was filmed in Glen Nevis, near Fort William. Glen Nevis is a valley with a base altitude of less than 600 feet above sea level that runs between very steep mountains that range between 3600 to 4400 feet tall; Elderslie, near Glasgow, is in very gently rolling country side where the tallest hill is only some 749 feet high (and takes its time rising to that height). (Again, this is like depicting George Washington's childhood home as having been in the Grand Canyon.)

The sons of knights did not dress in rags. Further, even poor Scots would have known how to sew (or at least had a family member who knew how to sew) -- poor people, even less than rich, could not afford to let their clothing unravel and disintegrate because they left edges un-hemmed.

There is no reason at all to think that late 13th century Scottish men had "mullet" haircuts from the 1980's. There is no reason at all to think they braided their hair. There is no reason at all to think they tied bits of fur or feathers in their hair. Further, there is no reason at all to think they hadn't ever encountered a comb... [In general, the hairstyles shown for the Scots throughout the film seem to be distinctly late 20th century fantasy in inspiration, influenced by the film "Last of the Mohican`s" and the television series "Xena: Warrior Princess" more than by history.]


A film depicting the English as ass-holes, fuelled by outrageously incorrect historical facts and film scenes in general, i`m not stating the English are/were not ass-holes in times gone by, far from it, especially to the Scots and Irish, but, think of people`s attitudes towards the English after watching this film?.

A great example of cloudy judgement regarding wrongly based views towards a whole race of people, for the sole reason they are the same nationality of those whom killed your family members whilst at war with them............................................

So, here I am around 10 years old, a new boy is introduced to the class as Karl Steadman and of German descent, I growled a little inside as I thought "What the hell are they doing letting German`s into our school?, they will kill us all for sure", this was obviously based on my only knowledge of German`s and that was watching old movies, the enemy, nasty, and horrible. After a while I started noticing that German boy, had identical traits to us, a few months later I started to speak to him, 6 months later he was my past friend, "Wow, the Germans are just like us",. Karl remained a very close friend until I moved away from the area.
 
 
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Okay, back to topic - One of the main reasons people in general do not believe in the Illuminati is...."But how would they infiltrate the governments and take control?", easily answered.........................

The Illuminati was started in the 1700's as truth seekers. The Catholic Chruch pretty much controlled the accepted belief such as the planets and entire universe revolving around the sun. The Illuminati used their technology to prove the church wrong but were eventually hunted down and went into hiding. Hundreds of years later people got bored of religion and politics were the next big way to control things. When Woodrow Wilson came into office he pretty much sold the United States to the banking system (which was owned by Illuminati family members) by signing the Federal Reserve Act. Their money system held the government in debt from that day forth. Using secret organizations such as the Skull & Bones or the Bohemian Grove the Illuminati corrupted world leaders to do their bidding.

The Illuminati owns all the banking systems, 90% of the media, and has the world leaders under their thumb. Owning the media they get the final say on the "official" story and what gets told in the newspapers and TV. The news broadcasters report to us what they're told; which is not always the truth.

Which brings me to "Just how much control does the media have over us?", I will try and break this down as best I can in an easy to understand format.

For those of us whom have never been to the middle East, our perception is based purely on what we have seen on the news, read in papers, watched documentaries on government/elitist owned channels.

When you hear Afghanistan/Iraqi/Libya/Syria mentioned on the news, do you automatically picture these countries/men like this, armed "Insurgents" against a backdrop of a bleak barren landscape, and living in run down ghetto like houses?.............




Scenery.webp





Taliban armed with rocket-propelled grenade launchers patrol outside Swat valley near Buner d...webp





taliban-fighters-001.webp





town.webp




Here`s what a high percentage of the actual populations look like, and some beautiful scenic landscapes that the MSM constantly fail to show in their broadcasts that mention the words "Terrorists" "Insurgents", more times than is healthy, feel free to google such aspects as breathtaking <insert random Muslim country here> scenery.

I have deliberately chosen pictures that clearly indicate these people don`t hate our Western ways, decadence, freedoms as much as we are force fed to believe, in this picture can be seen - A young girl drinking Pepsi, Orphaned girls studying English, Young men at University, an Afghanistan film producer and his son, an advert for a Muslim dating Agency, Muslim woman enjoying a night at the movies, some random scenic views, and a nice house with freshly mown lawn (just like ours)




images.webp



For the Illuminati to reach it`s goals and have control over the whole world, certain countries with staunch religious beliefs and no central banking systems will have to be forcibly induced with "Democracy" to come around to our way of thinking (theirs, not mine), early manipulation of these countries was far easier, introduce them to capitalism and buy their friendship by supplying arms and donating vast sums of money for their more needy people, build an Embassy, and boom, you`re in.

For those countries not willing to play, create a false flag event involving people from the targeted next country and declare war against them, show carefully manipulated video clips via the MSM channels you own, depicting the hardships of these people that you are fighting for to defend (be careful here and don`t let the films made by your soldiers committing paedophile rape go viral, the people funding these wars don`t like stuff like this, and ffs stop taking pictures of those malformed due to depleted uranium radiation sickness babies, we`re breaking every single protocol of the Geneva Convention by using this ammo).

The last war inducing false flag events (9/11 7/7) were very complex, but, the evidence is all there. Recent countries acquired without the need of false flag events Syria, Libya, using techniques that worked excellently for the last two (instigating political unrest), and based on certain aspects as explained by this guy.......

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Rather than go through all the 9/11 stuff, I have a far easier clear cut case of media manipulation/False Flag event, remember the Gulf War - Desert Storm?.

War was declared on Iraq for these false pretences, the main reason was Iraqi soldiers had stormed a maternity hospital and taken babies out of incubators, leaving them on the floor to die (see video at bottom).



..:: Pentagon lied that Iraqi forces stood at Saudi border

Before launching the Gulf War, Bush Sr. claimed that an Iraqi juggernaut was threatening to roll into Saudi Arabia. Citing top-secret satellite images, Pentagon officials estimated in mid–September that up to 250,000 Iraqi troops and 1,500 tanks stood on the border, threatening the key US oil supplier.

The St. Petersburg Times acquired two commercial Soviet satellite images of the same area, taken at the same time, and found no Iraqi troops were visible near the Saudi border — just empty desert.

After the war, Gen. Colin Powell admitted that there had been no massive build up. A US senior commander told Newsday after the war, "There was a great disinformation campaign surrounding this war."

..:: False testimony about Iraqi atrocities

Before the motion for war, members of Congress were presented with the tearful testimony of a 15-year-old Kuwaiti girl, known only as Nayirah. She described how, as a volunteer in a Kuwait maternity ward, she had seen Iraqi troops storm her hospital, steal the incubators, and leave 312 babies "on the cold floor to die." Seven US Senators later referred to the story during debate; the motion for war passed by just five votes. In the weeks after Nayirah spoke, President Bush senior invoked the incident five times, saying that such "ghastly atrocities" were like "Hitler revisited."

Nayirah was actually the daughter of the Kuwaiti ambassador to Washington and had no connection to the Kuwait hospital. She had been coached — along with the handful of others who would "corroborate" the story — by senior executives of Hill and Knowlton in Washington, which had a contract worth more than $10 million with the Kuwaitis to make the case for war.

..:: Pentagon lied about strength of Iraqi troops

After the war, the House Armed Services Committee issued a report on lessons learned from the Persian Gulf War. It concluded that at the start of the ground war in February, the US faced only 183,000 Iraqi troops, less than half the Pentagon estimate.

..:: CIA forged documents were presented to the UN Security Council

In Saddam's Bombmaker, scientist Khidhir Hamza describes a bogus story planted by the CIA in the Sunday Times on 2 April 1995. The story reported that Hamza had confirmed a secret Iraqi weapon programme, and claimed that he had been kidnapped in Greece and probably assassinated. The CIA had planted the story and documents in order to smoke him out, and it worked. Hamza contacted the US Embassy in Budapest was brought to the US.

A week later, Madeline Albright quoted the CIA-forged documents at the UN Security Council in order to prevent any relaxation of the regime of sanctions on Iraq.






That video was the reason the UN declared war on Iraq, are your eyes beginning to open yet?.
 
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MY eyes are already open and have been for a while. Thanks Roy for all your posts on this, makes me feel better I am not the only one seeing things for how they really are. ;)

Yw hun:), thinking outside the box is what it`s all about. A prime example is the Turin Shroud and the various experts in the respective fields that have run tests on it, these include - Historians including cloth specialists, Forensics, Pathologists, Graphics Specialists that bit mapped it and turned a 2 dimensional image into 3D, Scientists covering all branches, Radiologists, and probably more i`ve forgot about lol, covering all aspects......



All those that have rigorously tested the Shroud came to the same conclusion "Our tests are inconclusive of how exactly the image was produced, but, it`s suffice to say whatever caused the image was not man made",. Here`s where the average person will state "See I told you it wasn`t a fake", for us however, the story has just begun ;).

P.S. As you will know only to well hun, religion plays a huge part in all this especially the Pope and Christian based Icons.
 
Damn, I forgot these links in my earlier post regarding Syria/Libya and instigating political unrest...........


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Ofc, the government shills/misinformationists will tell us there were perfectly legitimate reasons for the most revered elite squadron in the world (SAS) to be roaming around Libya dressed as Arabs and carrying all that equipment.


A senior member of Benghazi's revolutionary council said: "They were carrying espionage equipment, reconnaissance equipment, multiple passports and weapons. This is no way to conduct yourself during an uprising.


And here we have an excellent example of the state run MSM doing their job perfectly, who else but my favourite news broadcasters whom never fail in telling today`s news as it was pre-planned a few years ago :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: the B.B.C..........


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The B.B.C`s spokesman`s explanation of this misdemeanour is complete and utter bollocks, there isn`t a News agency out there that broadcasts or shows pictures that are not 100% authenticated first, the source is verified by the news editor then passed on to the news anchors via auto-cues or sent to correspondents/journalists for release, it`s part and parcel of their legal bindings and protocols regarding Libel/Slander and the respective lawsuits these can and have brought, involving huge cash settlements.

But hey, what else do we expect from those that brought us this (ooops, we forgot to authenticate the source, the editor in charge that day will have a lot to answer for, his name will be on the film information sticker, stuck to the box containing the film)......................



Broadcasting the collapse of WTC7 26 minutes prematurely before it actually collapsed, someone wasn`t listening properly at the last briefing, regarding times for predetermined events to happen, the B.B.C. is the largest gatherer of world news in the world and thus have a huge archive, containing film reels, videos, DVD`s etc, in all this time they have lost only one piece of footage, guess which one?, honestly, you couldn`t make this up.



4. We no longer have the original tapes of our 9/11 coverage (for reasons of cock-up, not conspiracy). So if someone has got a recording of our output, I'd love to get hold of it. We do have the tapes for our sister channel News 24, but they don't help clear up the issue one way or another.



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PMFSL.
 
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I had watched the video with the Alien pictured crop circle recently.

I agree that there is no way that anyone would have made these crop circles, especially not farmers. The crop circles are FAR too symmetrical with a hell of a lot of detail in them.
 
 
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I had watched the video with the Alien pictured crop circle recently.

I agree that there is no way that anyone would have made these crop circles, especially not farmers. The crop circles are FAR too symmetrical with a hell of a lot of detail in them.

Hey hun :), without derailing to much, all I will add is, certain agencies are crying hoax, but, failing horribly to give any supporting evidence whatsoever as to why these are hoax, and more importantly what/who is creating them..............................

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Before I add more it dawned on me earlier, are there any politicians out there that are actually genuine and suspect a lot of leaders past and present ulterior motives?, and yes, I stumbled across one, who has voiced his concerns relating to certain events and for future targets of the New World Order......

“The drive of the Rockefellers and their allies is to create a one-world government combining supercapitalism and Communism under the same tent, all under their control…. Do I mean conspiracy? Yes I do. I am convinced there is such a plot, international in scope, generations old in planning, and incredibly evil in intent.”

Congressman Larry P. McDonald, 1976, killed in the Korean Airlines 747 that was shot down by the Soviet Union.

Source....

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Verifying without doubt that not only does the New World Order exist, but, to a certain extent it also has opposer's to it.


This man was privy to a whole heap of information that we would never have access to, which in due turn led him to his assessment that this had been going on for several years, it`s targets, he must have stumbled across some pretty damning evidence to give him a need to express his concerns, concerns unfortunately that cost him his life, unless of course anyone has a perfectly logic explanation as to why the Russians would see a commercial jet liner as threat, or at the very least had given it an escort until it is out of their air space.

After the attention that J.F.K. received it appears that TPTB let one of their counterparts take care of someone who could jeopardize their future plans.

Wonder why others do not speak out?.
 

"he must have"......how do you know?

IIRC, the shooting down was at a time of extreme tension between the superpowers, and the aircraft was way off course and well inside Russian airspace long periods. It was around the time of the SDI and Pershing II policies of the USA.

The wiki article is very detailed and explains it all logically. IMO it is ridiculous to even suggest their might have been a conspiracy involved. If "TPTB" wanted this congressman dead, they wouldn't have needed to kill hundreds along with him and possibly spark a third world war. Sorry Roy, but I'm not even slightly convinced on this one.

On the 9/11 conspiracy.......I would like some genuine honest guesstimates of how many people would be involved in any way with the deliberate collapse of all the WTC buildings and other related events in the Pentagon and Penn. i.e. they were personally doing something that was obviously part of a plan to make something happen e.g. anyone laying explosives at the base of the WTC buildings would HAVE to be asking themselves why.
 
QUOTE That`s all I have time for today. UNQUOTE

Phew, quite a lot of info... any positive counter forces worth mentioning here?

May I suggest NAM-MYO-HO-RENGE-KYO?
A jewel of ultimate wisdom representing expression of potentiality from unmanifest to manifest. The aim of the teaching is for people to chant and express their full human potential to enable them to be happy and fulfilled in a cooperative world.

Everything changes - nothing is permanent - transcending the sufferings of life and death we attain enlightenment to this truth. This teaching is based on enlightenment from the start. When you chant, enlightenment is expressed within the depths of your being, although you may not realise it.
 

Firstly, for Larry P. McDonald to have made his original statement.....
The drive of the Rockefellers and their allies is to create a one-world government combining supercapitalism and Communism under the same tent, all under their control…. Do I mean conspiracy? Yes I do. I am convinced there is such a plot, international in scope, generations old in planning, and incredibly evil in intent.”

He must have had some form of evidence as not only had he announced their intentions but named Rockefeller also, this isn`t the type of statement someone blurts out because they have a hunch.

Secondly, it is not hard to tamper with a planes navigation system for it to give incorrect readings of where it actually is, the tension that has been around since the cold war is a damn good excuse for all the super powers to have nuclear weapons, if Russia were that concerned about the Americans I doubt very much they would have sold them Alaska, okay, going back to the commercial airliner, it was Korean, it had veered off course and was duly blasted out of the sky, no questions asked, a few coincidences to many, if there was a genuine reason for the plane to have veered off course the pilots would have radioed through to the respective Russian air traffic controllers and explained their predicament,

There are certain protocols in place for when aircraft have encroached another countries airspace, there will always be communication via a radio asking why and warning them, they will then be met by interceptor jets and escorted back to the correct route they should have followed, if the 747 had bombing capabilities or was a jet fighter it would be explainable, there is no acceptable reason whatsoever for the Russians to have taken the action that they did, this mistake could happen at any given time to any pilots out there, what for arguments sake would pilots do if there was a huge thunderstorm over a stretch of their air route, and would place their passengers at huge risk in following this route?.

Also, the most restricted air space in the world is around Washington D.C. and in particular the Pentagon and White House, on 9/11/2001 a plane had been hijacked and flown off course for around an hour, the same day that had previously seen another two planes flown into buildings, you can`t tell me the alarm bells were not ringing here, why wasn`t this plane shot down?.

Thirdly, regarding the twin towers and WTC7, the wiring and placing of explosives could have been done over any given time thus needing very few people, a few weeks prior to 9/11 there was a complete shut- down
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during this power down sniffer dogs were removed and whole storeys were blocked off and rigorously guarded, no one was allowed to enter the floors where "Maintenance Work" was being carried out.

Of course there is/was security involved at the WTC, a little bit of research will bring you to who was on the board of the security firm at the WTC.......

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Bush`s younger brother Marvin.

There was testimonies from 503 first responders detailing over 20,000 pages depicting explosions (these are archived at the New York Daily Times) in explicit detail, this was completely overlooked at the 9/11 commission and no forensic tests were done on the steels regarding checking for explosives residue, the bulk of the steels were shipped to China for scrap as early as the next day.

There was however an independent test done on the steels by Physicist Steven Jones that produced this.........

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His analysis has been peer reviewed and of course his findings have been put through the normal reactions of shills/misinformationists including character assassination.

One aspect of explosives being used that can never be debunked is the heat produced that day that carried on for weeks after, this heat is reflected by thermal imaging photographs, this heat was far above that what it should have been, the main cause of fires was aviation fuel, this burns at nowhere near hot enough to weaken tempered construction steel let alone melt it, there were many accounts from several people testifying molten steel but these were rigorously denied by the government employed company put in place to explain why the towers collapsed, their findings to be used at the 9/11 commission report - NIST, let`s look at NIST`s explanation for the molten steel and resulting temperatures........



Once again, a very important factor regarding the collapse of the towers completely overlooked and denied, are we led to believe that the testimonies from 503 first responders and eye witness accounts are all fabricated and incorrect, why was this aspect never covered at the 9/11 commission?, a commission that by all intents and purposes was set up to find the truth, a commission that did not even know about the 3rd tower to collapse that day - WTC7 The Solomon Brothers tower, the self same tower that the B.B.C. reported had collapsed, 26 minutes prior to it actually collapsing.

Cheers,

Roy.
 
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Some interesting facts about flight KAL-007......

THE DEATH FLIGHT OF LARRY MCDONALD


Published in slightly abridged form in Flagpole Magazine, p. 7 (September 3, 2003).

Author: Donald E. Wilkes, Jr., Professor of Law, University of Georgia School of Law.

Twenty years ago, on Thursday, Sept. 1, 1983, Georgia Congressman Larry suffered a horrible death when the Boeing 747 airliner he was aboard was shot down by a Soviet fighter intercepter over the Sea of Japan. The 268 other persons on the plane also perished. The airliner, Korean Air Lines Flight 007, on its way to Seoul, South Korea, had twice entered Soviet airspace and was downed as it was about to leave Soviet airspace for the second time. Although many of the specific facts surrounding the shootdown of KAL 007 are unknown or disputed to this day, the violent death of the rabidly anti-Communist McDonald at the hands of the Soviet Union's Air Force appears to be a breathtaking example of the inscrutable workings of human fate and human destiny.

Lawrence Patton McDonald was born in Atlanta on Apr. 1, 1935, and graduated from the exclusive private Darlington High School in Rome in Floyd County in 1951. He then attended Davison College in North Carolina, and in 1957 received an M.D. degree from Emory University. He took postgraduate training in his speciality, urology, at the University of Michigan from 1963 to 1966. He later resided in Marietta and in 1974 was elected as a Democrat to the U.S. House of Representatives seat for affluent, ultraconservative Cobb County, and was serving his fifth term as congressman for that district at the time of his death.

Conservative to a psychopathic degree, the very embodiment of the lunatic fringe of the political far right, chairman of the John Birch Society, Larry McDonald was the most vociferous and fanatical right-wing extremist ever to sit in Congress. Although McDonald imagined that his political views were those of the Founding Fathers and as American as apple pie, in truth the reactionary conservative positions he staked out as to public policy issues were out of cloud-cuckoo-land. He voted against making Martin Luther King's birthday a holiday. He voted against funding of fair housing laws. "On Capitol Hill there was nobody more anti-Communist, anti-abortion, anti-homosexual, anti-gun control, or anti-big government (except where the military was concerned)," writes David E. Pearson in KAL 007: The Cover-Up (1987). McDonald's anti-Communism, like his other political posturing, was infatuated to the point of being fascistic. According to R. W. Johnson's Shootdown: Flight 007 and the American Connection (1986), McDonald once even attempted to nominate Rudolf Hess–the convicted Nazi war criminal then serving a life imprisonment sentence imposed at the Nuremberg Trial–for the Nobel Peace Prize, on the ground "that even a Nazi war criminal was a useful asset in the struggle against Communism." A political pariah during his nearly nine years in the House of Representatives, McDonald failed to obtain enactment of any legislation and was one of the most ineffectual congressmen in history.

Larry McDonald, the most famous person on board KAL 007, had not originally planned to be on the flight and ended up on the ill-fated airliner solely because of chance. Intending to travel to Seoul to participate in the celebration of the thirtieth anniversary of the United States-South Korea Mutual Defense Treaty, McDonald set out on his fatal journey on Sunday, Aug. 28, 1983 when he departed the Atlanta Airport on a flight bound for Kennedy Airport in New York City. Due to bad weather, McDonald's plane was diverted to Baltimore and when McDonald finally arrived at Kennedy he discovered he had missed his intended flight to Seoul by two or three minutes. He therefore decided to stay in New York City for two days and fly to Seoul on the KAL 007 flight which was scheduled to depart from Kennedy early on Wednesday, Aug. 31. In his last telephone conversation with his wife before boarding KAL 007, McDonald's wife (who had uneasy feelings about his trip) pleaded with him to cancel his visit to South Korea and come home, but McDonald refused.

With McDonald in aisle seat 02B in the first class section, KAL 007 duly took off on Aug. 31 at 12:24 a.m. local time, en route to Anchorage, Alaska for a scheduled stopover. After a 3,400 mile trip that lasted seven hours, the airliner landed in Anchorage. The plane remained on the ground for an hour and a half during which it was refueled, reprovisioned with food and drink, and cleaned and serviced. Four fortunate passengers, having completed their trips, disembarked at Anchorage, while several other passengers boarded the plane. The remaining passengers were given the option of leaving the aircraft and visiting the airport's huge duty-free shopping mall. Most did, but McDonald remained on the plane, catching up on his sleep. With a fresh flight crew, KAL 007 took off at 4 a.m. local time. The plane was scheduled to fly non-stop over the Pacific to Seoul's Kimpo International Airport, a nearly 4,500 mile stretch that would take slightly more than eight hours. There were 269 persons on board–246 passengers and 23 crew. "The passengers were a diverse group, including 75 South Koreans, 61 Americans, 23 Taiwanese, 28 Japanese, 15 Filipinos, 12 Chinese from Hong Kong, 10 Canadians, 6 Thais, and 4 Australians," Seymour Hersh writes in "The Target is Destroyed:" What Really Happened to Flight 007 and What America Knew About It (1986). "Twenty-three were children under twelve."

Although it was equipped with multiple sophisticated navigational systems and its cockpit crew was highly experienced and proficient, KAL 007 began deviating from its prescribed flight path within 10 minutes of takeoff. About three and a half hours into the flight, and by now hundreds of miles off course, KAL 007 began approaching Soviet territories where, as Oliver Clubb notes in KAL Flight 007: The Hidden Story (1985), "there [was] a highly important complex of Soviet strategic bases." Soon KAL 007 was flying over the Soviet Union's Kamchatka Peninsula, a barren and frozen 750-mile long land mass bristling with Soviet military and naval facilities, many of them top-secret. Soviet fighter jets were scrambled to deal with the intruder but failed to intercept the airliner. After flying through Soviet airspace for 38 minutes, Flight 007 exited Soviet territory. It then flew in international airspace over the Sea of Okhotsk for about an hour and a half. The airliner, which had now been aloft for five hours, then began to approach another part of the Soviet Union, Sakhalin Island, a long, thin island about half the size of Florida located southwest of the Sea of Okhotsk. Sakhalin was crammed with Soviet naval bases and shipyards, military airfields, and radar and intelligence-gathering facilities. KAL 007 actually re-entered Soviet airspace at 3:16 a.m. local time (it was still Aug. 31 in the United States, but now Sept. 1 here). As KAL 007 entered Soviet airspace for the second time in less than two hours, more Soviet fighter jets were sent up to deal with the intruder.

One of the planes sent up was an SU-15 supersonic fighter piloted by 39-year old Soviet Air Force Lt. Col. Gennadi Osipovich. After trailing the airliner for 60 miles, Osipovich was ordered to destroy the intruder, which in less than two minutes would exit Soviet airspace. At precisely 3:26 a.m. local time, from a distance of about three miles behind, he fired two air to air missiles at the airliner, which was cruising at about 35,000 feet. One missile was heat-seeking, the other radar-guided. The missiles, which each weighed 600 pounds (including a 70-pound high explosive warhead), whooshed toward the target at over 1,600 miles mph.

Less than five seconds later one or possibly both of the missiles struck the airliner. The resulting explosion was witnessed by the crew of a Japanese fishing boat six miles below who after hearing a loud bang looked up and saw what they described as "a glowing orange-colored, expanding fireball" which illuminated the night sky for around six seconds. Fatally damaged, the airliner did not immediately plummet into the icy waters of the Sea of Japan below; instead, with the cockpit crew struggling to control it, the aircraft began descending rapidly in vast, ever-widening spirals. Four minutes after being hit, KAL 007 had spiraled down to 16,000 feet, and eight minutes later it was at 2,000 feet. "[T]hen," as Alexander Dallin puts it bluntly in Black Box: KAL 007 and the Superpowers (1985), "having left Soviet territory, [the airliner] plunged vertically into the sea." From 2,000 feet about one minute would elapse until the doomed plane impacted with the sea. David E. Pearson writes that during those final 60 seconds, as the sea below appeared to be rushing up at them at fantastic speed, "time must have seemed an eternity for the innocent passengers on board. Their horror and fear must have been unbearable."

The last minutes of Larry McDonald's life had to have been worse than a nightmare. "The scene inside the plane must have been utterly terrifying–people falling and sliding, children screaming and an icy, knifelike wind shrieking into the plane as it fell and fell through an age of blackness," R. W. Johnson relates. "One cannot read, let alone write, about such scenes without experiencing the strongest and most elemental emotions.... A few of the passengers may have been lucky enough to have been killed outright by the metal fragments tearing through the plane. Those who were asleep would have been awoken by an immense shock wave and a terrifying crash. The oxygen would have been rapidly sucked out of the plane and the onrush of thin, freezing air would have produced both a thick mist and a tremendous drop in temperature. In these conditions, with people screaming and probably thrown about the cabin, many–most notably the babies and smaller children–would have failed to get their oxygen masks on.... [The passengers] who did not suffer rapid asphyxiation would have begun, quite rapidly, to freeze to death. Unfortunately, though, some would have got their oxygen masks on and the residual warmth of the cabin (plus their sleeping blankets) and the plane's rapid descent into more breathable air would have meant that some–perhaps many–of the 269 people aboard would have survived to live through another 12 minutes of utter terror before meeting their deaths."

Seymour Hersh also gives us a vivid description of how horrific those final moments must have been for McDonald and the other persons on KAL 007: "The attack came at a time when passengers would be asleep or trying to sleep; the last twelve minutes could only have been agonizing. The cabin, whether directly hit or penetrated by missile fragments, would immediately lose air pressure and would begin turning cold; some passengers, still strapped into their seats, may have been killed outright by shrapnel or debris as others watched terror-stricken. Those who suffered the most would be the ones who survived the first moments. The cabin would fog as the drop in air density caused the water vapor in the air to precipitate immediately. Within seconds the airliner's air-conditioning units, reacting to the sudden drop in temperature, would begin pumping heat into the cabin. Many of the passengers, protected by blankets and breathing through oxygen masks, would have survived the initial missile impact–and the descent to the sea–knowing that they were going to their death."

The KAL 007 shootdown unleashed ugly exchanges of recriminations between the United States and the Soviet Union. As Marilyn J. Young and Michael K. Launer astutely observe in Flights of Fancy, Flight of Doom: KAL 007 and Soviet-American Rhetoric (1988): "In mounting their respective propaganda campaigns, both the Reagan administration and the Andropov government withheld information, distorted the facts, and engaged in the ‘creation of truth.'"

Today, two decades after the KAL 007 death flight, the Soviet Union and its Communist regime no longer exist, and passions have cooled. Some new evidence concerning the tragedy is also available. Furthermore, an event occurring in 1988 has sapped noticeably American outrage about the downing of Larry McDonald's plane. Much of the revulsion Americans felt about the KAL 007 shootdown was premised on the instinctive assumption that (as Richard Rohmer asserts in Massacre 747 (1984)) "the shooting down of a civilian airliner has no justification in human, moral or civilized terms." Americans reacting to the KAL 007 deaths firmly thought that, as The New York Times wrote at the time, "There is no conceivable excuse for any nation shooting down a harmless airliner ... and no circumstance whatever justifies attacking an innocent plane." However, on July 3, 1988, less than five years after the KAL 007 disaster, a U.S. Navy vessel in the Persian Gulf, under the mistaken impression that it was threatened with attack by a hostile airplane, fired a ground to air missile at an innocent commercial airliner, Iran Air Flight 655, which in broad daylight was flying within its approved flight path over international waters and had not strayed into any unauthorized airspace. The missile destroyed Flight 655, and all 290 persons aboard were killed. Both the Reagan administration and the American press trotted out various excuses for the downing of the Iranian airliner, expressed sympathy for the captain of the vessel that fired the missile, and claimed that the flight crew of the airliner was partly at fault for what happened. But the Flight 655 incident forever ended this country's previous confident assumption that military attacks destroying civilian airliners were in all cases outrageous, barbaric, and uncivilized.

What, then, are some of the dispassionate conclusions which at the present time may be drawn about the KAL 007 tragedy?

First, contrary to what the United States maintained at the time, it is now definitely established that prior to the shootdown the Soviets made unsuccessful efforts to communicate with the airliner by radio, that before any missiles were launched the fighters used their cannons to fire bursts of warning shots which the airliner ignored, and that the Soviets did not know that the plane they were attacking was a civilian airliner. Furthermore, it is almost certain that the Soviets mistook the airliner for a Boeing 707 American intelligence aircraft which was operating off the coast of Kamchatka and was in the vicinity of KAL 007 two hours before the shootdown.

Second, although it was kept secret at the time, within a day or two of the shootdown American intelligence agencies knew that the Soviets had attacked KAL 007 without realizing it was a civilian airliner.

Third, from an examination of the cockpit conversation during the half-hour preceding the missile attack it is now known that, to quote a 1993 report by the International Civil Aviation Organization, there was "a normal, relaxed atmosphere on the flight deck of KAL 007," and that "the flight crew of KAL 007 was not aware of the presence of the [Soviet] interceptor aircraft before or at the time of the attack." The ICAO's report is based on a transcript of the plane's cockpit voice recorder tapes. Those tapes, after being surreptitiously recovered and then hidden away by the Soviet Union, were handed over to the ICAO by the Russian Federation (the Soviet Union's successor) in 1992. The seven-page transcript, which tells us everything that was said by the flight crew during the period beginning 32 minutes before the plane was hit and ending one and a half minutes after the sound of an explosion, is available online and may be viewed by visiting the Aviation Safety Network Homepage (www.aviation-safety.net/cvr/cvr_ke007.htm). Thus, it may be definitely concluded that nothing in the known cockpit conversation indicates that KAL 007 was on a spy mission, that the aircraft took any evasive actions prior to the attack, or that it was even aware of the mortal danger facing it.

Fourth, in view of the United States's massive radar and electronic surveillance capabilities in the Far East, it is fairly certain that American intelligence agencies were lying when they claimed that during the flight they were unaware that KAL 007 was dangerously off course and that consequently they could not have arranged for the airliner to be warned that it was in peril.

Fifth, while it remains unknown why KAL 007 deviated from its authorized flight path and ended up flying into Soviet airspace, the numerous explanations once offered for the deviation have been reduced to two. The first is that KAL 007 innocently strayed from its course because the flight crew committed but failed to detect enormous navigational errors. The second is that the airliner was intentionally off course because it was on a spying mission (presumably for a United States intelligence agency).

The main problem with the first explanation is that it compels us to believe things that are impossibly unlikely–namely, that an experienced and skilled flight crew not only displayed a shocking lack of alertness and attentiveness, but also omitted to perform a huge number of required navigational instrument checks while ignoring a staggering number of warnings. As Oliver Clubb correctly notes, the theory that KAL 007 accidently strayed "assume that the airliner's crew did not properly carry out any of a whole series of routine procedures–any one of which, properly carried out, would have negated the possibility of gross deviation in the first instance or enabled the crew to discover that deviation and bring the aircraft back on course. The picture here is of an unbelievably incompetent, irresponsible, and careless air crew.... [T]he odds against all of these virtually inconceivable errors of commission and omission taking place ... are astronomical."

The principal problem with second explanation–that there was a deliberate diversion from the planned flight route for the purpose of intelligence-gathering–is that, while there are a number of highly suspicious circumstances pointing in the direction of this possibility, there is still no solid or conclusive evidence in support of this hypothesis. The KAL 007 cockpit tape recordings certainly do not give any indication of a possible espionage mission. On the other hand, it must be realized that American intelligence agencies had used civilian planes for spying operations in the past and that if they had done so in this case they would hardly admit it and would be expert at covering up their involvement.

The corpse of Larry McDonald was never recovered from the depths of the Sea of Japan, and today he seems a nearly forgotten figure from a bygone era.

John Calvin, the Reformation theologian, would not admit the existence of such a thing as fortune or chance; "we [do not] suppose fortune holds any dominion over the world and mankind, and whirls about all things," he wrote in his famous Institutes. "Fortune and chance are words ... with [no] signification." But the fate of Larry McDonald suggests the contrary. McDonald would not have died a violent death at age 48 if it had not been for a series of chance events. How different, we realize, McDonald's destiny might have been if, after his plane from Atlanta was diverted, he had arrived at the New York airport a few minutes earlier and been able to board his intended flight; if he had decided to reschedule his journey by taking some flight other than KAL 007; if his wife's forebodings had persuaded him to scrap his plans to go to South Korea and he had never boarded KAL 007; if after leaving Anchorage KAL 007 had remained on course, or had corrected its course when it strayed; if KAL 007 had entered Soviet airspace only once rather than twice; if no American reconnaissance aircraft had been in the same vicinity as KAL 007 at about the same time; if KAL 007 had responded to Soviet radio inquiries or heeded Soviet warnings; or if, before the fighter was prepared to launch its missiles, KAL 007 had been able to make it into the international airspace that was so near when the missiles were fired. The goddess of fortune, however, seems not to have smiled on him, and chance events appear to have inexorably doomed him. Because any of these "ifs" could have happened, and none of them did, was not Larry McDonald therefore fated to die?

One of the few Georgia memorials to Larry McDonald is the segment of I-75 running through Cobb county, which is named after him. In this way does Cobb county–the county where Leo Frank was lynched by respectable local citizens and where the lynchers were admired and protected and their identities concealed as part of a coverup by the local citizenry that continues to this day, the county that later elected Bob Barr to Congress, the county whose governing body a few years ago approved a resolution condemning "the gay lifestyle," the county where currently public school teaching of the scientific truths of biology is under attack and hamstrung due to the opposition of the right-wing political elements that regard evolution as against the Bible–pay its respects to Larry McDonald.

The incident in which Larry McDonald died was a catastrophic tragedy in which many innocent lives, including children and babies, were lost. It is also true, in the words of the old apothegm, that of the dead nothing should be said but good. But Larry McDonald was a demented, repulsive politician whose politics were so loathsome and his political career so vile that with regard to his death harsh judgments cannot be ameliorated by the awful circumstances of his demise.


A southern Democrat lawmaker, who was also jointly Chairman of the John Birch Society and President of Western Goals Foundation, both famously anti-Globalist/anti-communist organizations, and who had announced to his advisors in the weeks prior to his death that he would be seeking the Presidency of the United States--as a conservative Democrat--in 1988. A cousin of WWII hero General George S. Patton, and who had inherited Patton's mountain of anti-Soviet Intelligence records; who had organized a private Intelligence network which threatened to rival that of the CIA--at once commanding, polished on-the-stump and movie-star handsome: ...the kind of man who could seriously derail the Presidential aspirations of George Herbert Walker Bush, the elder.

McDonald was a strong contender for the Presidency, without Bush Sr gaining this, it would have put a huge dent in the New World Order`s long term plans and targets including their enforced introduction into Democracy and central banking systems starting with Desert Storm and the declaration of war against Iraq based on prolific lies and deceit.............


And none have been proven to be fabricated more than this one...................

 
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Thanks for the information Roy :)

Unfortunately, I don't really have a strong enough concern that we are all imperiled by a group of unknowns who attempt to control (very poorly I may add) the course of world affairs to reply to all of your arguments. It's a bit like someone else we know who makes their arguments so long that nobody has the time or inclination to point out all the errors, making those arguments in turn appear valid and fully accepted as true.......although I know you better, and I know that, for you, it is a real passion.

Just a couple of things however. In regards to the KAL disaster, the explanation in the wiki article I linked to is perfectly logical, and contradicts most of what you say. If you haven't read it, I would be grateful if you did and share your thoughts on the content.

In reference to the Iranian airline disaster, it was a clear case of the ship's captain being where he should not have been, combined with a design fault in the radar system that identified the airline as an Iranian fighter taking off right behind the airliner and continuing to relay data from the fighter even though the screen cursor was on the airliner, and the fact that the ship was engaged in a surface battle. Another complication was that the ship was using Bahrain time, whilst the flight schedule provided by Iran was in Iranian time (these schedules are provided to warships in the gulf to prevent such accidents), hence the warship was unable to match the airliner with any scheduled flight (plus the flight was late).

Lastly, one of the biggest problems with the CT community is that when a lone scholar comes up with an article/report supporting their theories, or some poster comes up with a new "fact" or "angle", the CTs immediately hold it up as watertight and use it to add credibility to their CT.......however, when a scholar comes forward with a contrary explanation, they are automatically "part of the conspiracy" or "part of an engineered plan of misinformation", and those posters who present alternate theories and solid facts are labelled "misinformationalists", "shills", and "character assassins"......in fact you do it too Roy, although perhaps not as badly as many I've read. Here is where the CT community is making a grave error in communication.......once you make it about people and not facts, you lose most logical open-minded readers, as they are interested in facts and not whether someone might be one thing or another.

A fact is a fact, regardless of who presents it, and in the 9/11 CT I see a LOT of conjecture, supposition, and "what if/why didn't". These are not facts.

It's also important to note that the fact that so many explanations and theories exist about the WTC collapses shows that NOBODY REALLY KNOWS what ACTUALLY happened inside the buildings structure.....otherwise everyone would agree, as it would be a FACT. The scientific community has no prior event of this magnitude to compare with, and until the same tower construction collapses under the same conditions then we won't know for sure.

I know you kinda answered my question about how many people would need to be involved in such a HUGE conspiracy......but you kinda didn't. Let's assume there were "only a few" who were involved in the placing of charges......how about the rest of the conspiracy? You're asking me to believe that NOBODY among the hundreds if not thousands of people who would have to be involved in such a conspiracy (in my estimate) had ANY scruples about killing thousands of their countrymen? I would love to see the results of a secret ballot among the military about whether they would participate in such a plan....and the military would have to have been involved at some point. It would only take ONE person to go public about it and the whole event could NEVER take place EVER.....as it would be immediately obvious the person was right and it would bring down a government, if not the country.

As for the BBC 26 mins thing.....there are so many logical explanations for this it isn't funny. The madness and fluidity of that day caused MANY misreports and incorrect information to be broadcast as fact. The idea that "someone wasn't listening at the briefing" is just ridiculous, as it implies that OTHER countries were involved in the conspiracies, and even MORE ridiculous, foreign MEDIA. Anyone who knows a media person/journalist personally would know that something like this would never fly for a second. It has been proven time and time again that a message relayed from one person to another will transform along the journey.....it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that "WTC07 is about to collapse" could very easily become "WTC07 has collapsed" after being relayed through a few people on the ground during intense confusion. The argument that "the anchor was reporting the collapse with the building clearly visible in the background" is a real straw-clutcher. Firstly, the anchor wasn't looking backwards, and even if they HAD done so seconds before the report, how would they know which building was WTC07? I reckon most people would have struggled to tell you which building was WTC07 before 9/11, and probably even more so on the day.

Very lastly.....the "steel shouldn't have melted" argument. Who took the actual temperature of the steel and the surroundings at the time of collapse?

Bottom line. The CT community relies almost exclusively on process of elimination. I haven't seen any 9/11 events that don't have a logical, scientific explanation. Just because the CT don't like or agree with those explanations, doesn't make them less plausible I.e. for process of elimination to work, you must show ALL other explanations to be completely false.....and AFAIK, such elimination is not possible in regards to the events surrounding 9/11.

It's nothing personal Roy.....I hope you know that :)
 
To those wanting to debate 9/11 I will be adding more about this in my symbolism thread, I had intended adding more stuff there, as like I have previously stated I haven`t even scratched the surface yet, I have been hindered somewhat with regards to adding more stuff as my main source of video clips and hard to obtain photos has been eradicated due to my account at ATS being one of the thousands that got hacked and all the relative data being deleted, however, one of my close contacts whom I befriended at ATS is going to email me some of the main pictures I need for my next post relating to 9/11.

Okay, back to topic. It`s a well known documented fact that the Illuminati like to release subliminal type messages about their future plans courtesy of the media and films, none blow my mind more than the Illuminati card game released by Steve Jackson Games. I have selected some of the cards that are relevant, I have also added some real life pictures to show the similarities between them and what actually happened, the cards......


cards.webp


The cards depict a terrorist attack against what is clearly shown as two tower blocks, also if you look to the left of this card you will see the all seeing eye - The chosen symbol of the Illuminati, a card with the words GOAL Population Reduction and smoke rising from what is clearly two towers, a tidal wave hitting a nuclear power plant, a nuclear disaster, and what appears to be Asian type people panic stricken as a clock bearing the time of 14:55 or 11:12 is shown, I Googled Japanese clock tower and added a picture of the clock it produced (The Wako Clock tower at Ginza in Tokyo) which bears an uncanny resemblance to the clock on the card, the Lady Diana card states that she is immune to everything bar the media - so, she is vulnerable to the media.

Well, so what, you may think, someone is cashing in on past world events by releasing a game, think again, these cards were released in 1995, two years before the death of Lady Diana due to being chased by the paparazzi (media), six years before the 9/11 attacks, and sixteen years prior to the Japanese Tsunami disaster, which amongst other aspects caused a tidal wave to hit a nuclear power plant.

Predicting the death of someone or an alleged attack by terrorists can of course be predicted if you have insider information about them, however, an act of nature cannot be predicted nor triggered by mankind, or can it?, as I stated previously the world in general is way behind the technical capabilities of the government`s, there is a lot of talk out there of HAARP - High Frequency Active Auroral Program.

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Project Bluebeam in action, pay attention to the videos showing what was believed to be a UFO over Norway (a well documented incident)......

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Once you have watched the videos and looked at the pictures you will notice a light in the sky caused by the satellites used when HAARP is in operation, also, there are hundreds of accounts of people hearing weird noises and strange lights in the sky from around the globe, okay, remember the light in the sky?...............................





Google Steve Jackson gets raided by the secret services, makes for some interesting reading, his Illuminati RPG with the cards are based on either - An uncanny sense to be able to predict the future, or, he had some insider information.
 
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