Venting Higher RTP's getting rarer

[Troglodyte]

Have you noticed the higher RTP's making way to lower versions in the online casinos you frequent? I'm talking about those 96-97% figures getting rid of in favor of sub-95%.

A week ago I played in my small native casino and after losing my deposit pretty swiftly it occurred to me to check the RRP's of some of the slot I had been playing. Turns out, all the Hacksaws had been quietly lowered from the ordinary ~96.4 or all the way to ~94.3 and the NoLimits also from 96+ to barely 94. I actually felt cheated and scammed. From my usual providers the Pragmatic Plays are still at their usual 96.4-96.7 and ditto on the PlayNGos. I won't play those lower RTP slots if I can help it.

Then today I was able to regain access to Bet365's casino (had a long self-exclusion period) and much to my chagrin I noticed the same phenomenon, though there didn't seem to be clear consistency among some of the games, eg. a couple of Pragmatic's Big Bass games were still 96+ while the rest were all lowered.

As for the rest of the casinos I frequent (this is all online), the lower RTP's seem to be the norm now. Is this the dawn of the reasonable RTP's, what do you think?

Having said all that, I still have one casino which has kept the better RTP's yet I'm a big loser there, too so I suppose it's arguable whether it even matters...

 

[Lucky Loser]

I only play slots over 96%.

I've had to stop playing many of my favourites as my go to casinos are choosing the lower RTP versions. Playtech are now 94% across the board for me and some other providers like Mascot and Popiplay are 91/92%. It sucks.

 

[teckiwi]

Sadly for us in New Zealand it's only going to get worse, Gov is planning to introduce legislation to get profit sharing deals with online casinos or require them to block us from playing on them.

So imagine a provider like Leovegas having it's margin cut in half, they will 100% switch to lower RTP options to maintain a healthy margin at the players expense. What todays 96.5% will become the 92% RTP option etc.

 

[lucks_maximus]

Having said all that, I still have one casino which has kept the better RTP's yet I'm a big loser there, too so I suppose it's arguable whether it even matters...

RTP matters, but luck matters more!!

 

[armster]

Yup. All these casinos offering capped welcome bonuses have also lowered rtp almost across the board. Playing is truly becoming like being stuck in mud. I see a future where slots just become less favorable an option in the gambling world. You can go on a cold streak and lose piles of money and when it eventually turns around and you hit those big runs winning a bunch of money back you are capped at how much you can actually withdraw. Having two things working against you in this fashion has just turned a good time into the most boring shit ever and now a little more expensive

These groups like novatrix srl (casinos formerly operating under dama and hollycorn) have become a meme of capped wins and shitty rtp all while paying for the lowest of the low licensing.

 

[anddi32]

Having said all that, I still have one casino which has kept the better RTP's yet I'm a big loser there, too so I suppose it's arguable whether it even matters...

RTP always matters. You can try the 96 version and the 91 version of the same game, you don't need thousands of spins to notice how the lower version feels completely different game.

The bonus interval can be longer, the probability of big wins is much lower, and the base game drains your bankroll much faster. This won't happen in every session, but on average over a long run, the difference will be huge.

 

[satchnz]

Add to this the ever increasing and very disappointing trend of providers releasing new games with a maximum RTP option of only 94% (ELK Studios are one example but there are a number of others). This doesn’t even give us crypto players a better choice offshore…

EDIT: These providers should be named and shamed.

 

[lucks_maximus]

Add to this the ever increasing and very disappointing trend of providers releasing new games with a maximum RTP option of only 94% (ELK Studios are one example but there are a number of others). This doesn’t even give us crypto players a better choice offshore…

EDIT: These providers should be named and shamed.

ELK's two newest games (as well as upcoming games) have 96%. So they came to their senses.

 

[satchnz]

ELK's two newest games (as well as upcoming games) have 96%. So they came to their senses.

Wow, I didn’t realise!

I do like playing new release ELK slots even though the potential for winning big on them seems unlikely. Some of their mechanics are refreshing even if the maths model is lacking.

Thanks for highlighting this.

 

[lockinlove]

One of the biggest and obvious differences in just 2% rtp difference can be proven on big bass bonanza.

Go play it on 94% and tell me how you feel.

The 2% difference is massive. It changes the payout and game machanics massively.

Can you win on 94%? Yes.

However you will lose alot more, faster with less bonuses, less paying bonuses than 96%.

Casinos were happy with 3-4% edge. They made alot of money.

Now they want 6%-10% edge.

If you are knowingly and willingly constantly playing on 92-94% rtp slots, I am going to group you in with the term degenerate.

 

[teckiwi]

^^Yes the 2% lower RTP slots can be tens of dead basegame spins without winnign anything, totally brutal payout structures because it's done in a lazy way.

 

[09237653]

Whitehat dropped all of their playngos to 91% but I have not played any of their casinos since they dropped to 94%, meanwhile slots temple with their 96% versions are getting daily deposits from me.

wonder if a casino would rather have three people playing at 91% or 150 people playing at 96%, I know what I would pick

 

[nisosbar]

This idea comes up over and over, the idea that the casinos are lowering RTP's or scamming players somehow to get a bigger edge. For example, removing 5 or 10 face cards from a blackjack shoe to favor the house even more.

And then the response from casino shills is always some variation of, "But they don't HAVE to. The game has a built-in house edge. They wouldn't risk that."

And then, lo and behold, a scandal erupts - a casino has been found to have been removing face cards, or tinkering with the slots, or (not as scandalous) implementing hold times on withdrawals, sometimes up to a week or more waits.

Greed is pernicious, and it tends to destroy human relationships, whether personal or business.

Long-winded way of saying, if casinos can get away with lowering RTP's and it makes no difference in how many players they have or how much those players spend or how long their sessions are, then you better believe they are going to lower those RTP's to the maximum they can get away with. It's not complicated.

 

[teckiwi]

RTP always matters. You can try the 96 version and the 91 version of the same game, you don't need thousands of spins to notice how the lower version feels completely different game.

The bonus interval can be longer, the probability of big wins is much lower, and the base game drains your bankroll much faster. This won't happen in every session, but on average over a long run, the difference will be huge.

I know it would hurt casino business but I feel like they should allow players to sort by RTP onsite etc to make ti easier to mae an informed choice, I know some decent casinos show RTP in the thumbnail etc but many require loading the game and checking it hidden away in settings which sucks.

 

[satchnz]

I know it would hurt casino business but I feel like they should allow players to sort by RTP onsite etc to make ti easier to mae an informed choice, I know some decent casinos show RTP in the thumbnail etc but many require loading the game and checking it hidden away in settings which sucks.

Some crypto casinos lead the way here in terms of displaying the RTP of slots before needing to open them (but these tend to be the max RTP casinos and that stands to reason).

Some also show a 24 hour RTP being what the game actually returned in the past 24 hours. If you are one to believe that a slot is “due” after a cold streak, it adds another dimension. In reality, it makes no difference but it’s interesting to see.

If you carry rock bottom RTP versions of your slots then there’s no way in hell you want to point this out to your customers. All it will do is raise awareness of what RTP means, and that it varies between casinos, and that is bad for business.

Displaying RTP upfront should be law.

 

[Troglodyte]

^

I do most of my slot gaming on a site that is very open about RTP and sort of takes pride in having the highest RTP version of each slot. The RTP number is visible on all slots in the casino lobby. It only accepts customers from five distinctive countries, though (the UK being not one of them and aren't most here from those islands?).

Several years ago I mostly played on Unibet. They had the higher, decent RTPs and for a good stretch they even had a selected assortment of half a dozen slot with an exclusive 97+ RTP. Then, all of a sudden, without a notice they dropped the assortment and lowered most RTPs. I promptly decimated my volume on the site.