Resolved 21casino have reduced RTPs - website still shows higher RTPs

[09237653]

More shady RTP business, (must be a day of the week ending in Y.)

Playngo now at 94% on 21casino, Players not notified and the website still advertising the games at 96%.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Shame, White Hat Gaming letting go of the one thing that stood them out against the competition.

Now they are just White Hat Gaming again.

Lets face it, WHG were not that popular a choice for a knowledgable player in the first place.

Personally, I cannot see a good reason to choose their casinos over others now. Nothing unique about them anymore.

 

[PMKFRUITPRO]

Get use to it I’m afraid.

Poor form not to update the website to show it tho.

Goes on a lot now it seems and again we all know fuck all will be done about it. Even tho it’s blatant false advertising.

This is sort of thing UKGC needs to clamp down on rather than fucking about with auto play buttons.

 

[psmith2020]

the gambling commision dont care as its all about the money

plus uk digital machines change %s regular and game updates while your playing as they lock the unit out via the remote game controler and put machine in matience mode

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Thanks for the heads-up.

Also covers the William Hill stuff and different RTPs between demo mode/real mode at other casinos.

 

[dealer wins]

What casinos still run png at full rtp. Shame as 21Casino is the one place I still play at, not anymore.

 

[Mouse75]

What casinos still run png at full rtp. Shame as 21Casino is the one place I still play at, not anymore.

RIZK do.. at least for the moment anyway!!

 

[Mouse75]

Thanks for the heads-up.

Also covers the William Hill stuff and different RTPs between demo mode/real mode at other casinos.

@ChopleyIOM Some entertainment for after work later - Thanks Mister!!

 

[Downsman]

Novibet has PNG's at 96%.

 

[dealer wins]

RIZK do.. at least for the moment anyway!!

Just signing up, I am not putting up with RTPs below 96%, as you just dont get enough play time for your money at anything less than that.

 

[TheAddict]

Seems png taken down atm from the 2 WHG sites I play.
Well, goodbye Rich. It was an emotional run. We had some good times.

 

[Klaaiboer]

What casinos still run png at full rtp. Shame as 21Casino is the one place I still play at, not anymore.

Betsson, Casino Euro, Guts, Rizk, Kaboo, a few I know; and a few smaller ones like Scatters

 

[irish-ranger]

Well this morning was my last deposit on 21 mores the pitty I didn't know before hand
No doubt by the time the weeks out the whole group will have followed suite

 

[Mouse75]

Just signing up, I am not putting up with RTPs below 96%, as you just dont get enough play time for your money at anything less than that.

They have one anomaly for some reason - the "Charlie Chance goes to Hell" or whatever its called - that launched at RIZK at 94% but every game before and after is on the higher RTP.
God knows what happened with this one - or if they have corrected it - i've never checked.

 

[jacksparks]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

 

[colinsunderland]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Excellent

 

[Mouse75]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Excellent behaviour!!!!
Truly impressed especially in this day and age

 

[bamberfishcake]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Thats fantastic!

Post of the year so far

 

[bamberfishcake]

What casinos still run png at full rtp. Shame as 21Casino is the one place I still play at, not anymore.

Dont forget Unibet

 

[09237653]

So I checked again this evening and they have been restored to 96%.
Seems it was it a mistake. see jacksparks post above.

 

[Spikie]

I don’t even play at 21 Casino , but full credit to them for not taking advantage of the situation.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Thanks for that Jack, slightly alarming that a game provider can make an 'error' that increases the house edge by 50% across a range of games and makes your own site's RTP numbers incorrect in the process!

Why is it always PnG that seem to be the provider involved with stuff like this?

I can see they're now back online at your site running at the top RTP again, so that's good to see.

I'll do an updated video tomorrow.

 

[09237653]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Sorry I must have missed this post. Thank you for clarifying that it was just a mistake.

Thread can now be deleted or edited to reflect this (I cant edit it myself)

 

[irish-ranger]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Best news I've had since the x wife told me she was leaving

 

[Kroffe]

Thanks for that Jack, slightly alarming that a game provider can make an 'error' that increases the house edge by 50% across a range of games and makes your own site's RTP numbers incorrect in the process!

Why is it always PnG that seem to be the provider involved with stuff like this?

I can see they're now back online at your site running at the top RTP again, so that's good to see.

I'll do an updated video tomorrow.

Im a bit interested how it could even happen.
Seems like something that would take more than just a wrong press of a button.

Maybe a test run to see how much more monies the lower versions would bring.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Im a bit interested how it could even happen.
Seems like something that would take more than just a wrong press of a button.

Maybe a test run to see how much more monies the lower versions would bring.

Yes I'm curious too. I mean, we all know that the games are served by the providers themselves and then integrated into whatever platform the casino is using, and that whatever version of the games the casino asks for will be served, but for a provider to arbitrarily reduce the RTPs of all their games at a casino or casinos, effectively against the casino's will - (were more casinos than just 21Casino affected?) - is pretty bad, not least because it then leads to players thinking that the casino has pulled a dirty trick on them.

And the thing is in the current climate of casino groups nerfing payouts left, right and centre, it's an entirely believable state of affairs, despite the fact that in this case 21Casino did nothing wrong.

This also shows the inherent problems and risks of having different maths models for exactly the same games floating around, with nothing more than a number in a helpfile to show which is which.

If the UKGC knew a bit more about the market they were regulating, this is the sort of stuff they'd be sorting out. I'd enforce a message on the loading screen on every single slot that clearly shows the RTP the game is running at, that is directly linked to the game version being pushed out from the server, and would not be changeable by operators or providers, it'd be baked into the game.

Not only would this give players a super-clear indication of what they're playing, it'd let them easily see when changes have been made, and would make casinos such as 21Casino look better to players as they'd have the comfort of seeing the top RTPs all the time.

Just make it mandatory for every single slot to look like this when loading in.

 

[09237653]

Maybe the 'default' UK setting is just 94% now and the tech staff are just not used to it yet.

 

[dealer wins]

At least I got a new casino to try now, Risk!

 

[dealer wins]

Tell you what, when I went to deposit into Risk, they asked for my ID and address check first, uploaded docs, and was verified in 8 minutes.

Thats at least 48 hours quicker than any casino I have ever used, and the 1st one not to take my money until they were happy with my ID. Thumbs up so far. Now more importantly, are they a lucky casino loooool

 

[Mouse75]

Yes I'm curious too. I mean, we all know that the games are served by the providers themselves and then integrated into whatever platform the casino is using, and that whatever version of the games the casino asks for will be served, but for a provider to arbitrarily reduce the RTPs of all their games at a casino or casinos, effectively against the casino's will - (were more casinos than just 21Casino affected?) - is pretty bad, not least because it then leads to players thinking that the casino has pulled a dirty trick on them.

And the thing is in the current climate of casino groups nerfing payouts left, right and centre, it's an entirely believable state of affairs, despite the fact that in this case 21Casino did nothing wrong.

This also shows the inherent problems and risks of having different maths models for exactly the same games floating around, with nothing more than a number in a helpfile to show which is which.

If the UKGC knew a bit more about the market they were regulating, this is the sort of stuff they'd be sorting out. I'd enforce a message on the loading screen on every single slot that clearly shows the RTP the game is running at, that is directly linked to the game version being pushed out from the server, and would not be changeable by operators or providers, it'd be baked into the game.

Not only would this give players a super-clear indication of what they're playing, it'd let them easily see when changes have been made, and would make casinos such as 21Casino look better to players as they'd have the comfort of seeing the top RTPs all the time.

Just make it mandatory for every single slot to look like this when loading in.

View attachment 151889

Agree totally - such an easy concept and far far far more proactive than banning autoplay

 

[Mouse75]

Tell you what, when I went to deposit into Risk, they asked for my ID and address check first, uploaded docs, and was verified in 8 minutes.

Thats at least 48 hours quicker than any casino I have ever used, and the 1st one not to take my money until they were happy with my ID. Thumbs up so far. Now more importantly, are they a lucky casino loooool

I hit some sort of overall trigger for my account on Boxing day - been there for best part of 2 years and apparently my total deposits had hit a trigger limit, so they asked for SoW... sigh...
However - I uploaded a payslip, and was fully verified again in under 24 hours.
TBH - i thought this was decent as well.
They also emailed me advising they were setting a loss limit of 10% of my income monthly ( not a deposit limit) which they would happily review if i provided further source of income docs.
I actually think this is pretty damn reasonable - and I dont see it as a nanny state approach, rather that they do believe in responsible gambling.

 

[Casinofreak777]

Looks like 1x2 gaming now comes with two RTP versions of their latest games as well, 94% or 96% here WHG has chosen 94%

 

[PMKFRUITPRO]

Thanks for that Jack, slightly alarming that a game provider can make an 'error' that increases the house edge by 50% across a range of games and makes your own site's RTP numbers incorrect in the process!

Why is it always PnG that seem to be the provider involved with stuff like this?

I can see they're now back online at your site running at the top RTP again, so that's good to see.

I'll do an updated video tomorrow.

Yes it is........ I’m calling that’s complete bollox.

 

[KasinoKing]

Tell you what, when I went to deposit into Risk, they asked for my ID and address check first, uploaded docs, and was verified in 8 minutes.

Thats at least 48 hours quicker than any casino I have ever used, and the 1st one not to take my money until they were happy with my ID. Thumbs up so far. Now more importantly, are they a lucky casino loooool

Well you were very lucky!
So far I have been waiting 8 WEEKS for them to approve my documents

I opened my account there in February 2016, in total I have deposited £3,200 and withdrawn £0, but they suddenly locked my account in January (with £200 in there) asking for SOW. I have provided the info 3 times... but am still locked out. So be careful.

KK

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Video to reflect the explanation from Jack and changes made

 

[bamberfishcake]

Not sure if I should start a new thread as the title implies shady business.

But, the new release from Play'n GO - Court of Hearts is showing as 94.23%.

Dracula from StakeLogic is 93.6%

So, maybe the error was not such an error after all. Or maybe the error raised a few profits eyebrows

Either way, running out of sites to play Play'n Go. Never really cared too much about StakeLogic and not looking like I will get much chance to either.

 

[09237653]

Not sure if I should start a new thread as the title implies shady business.

But, the new release from Play'n GO - Court of Hearts is showing as 94.23%.

View attachment 154449

Dracula from StakeLogic is 93.6%

View attachment 154450

So, maybe the error was not such an error after all. Or maybe the error raised a few profits eyebrows

Either way, running out of sites to play Play'n Go. Never really cared too much about StakeLogic and not looking like I will get much chance to either.

Check the game itself, the green knight is also showing 94% on website but in game it is 96%.
The internal help file on the new game is showing 96.27%.

 

[hhhelllo]

Best news I've had since the x wife told me she was leaving

LOL

 

[bamberfishcake]

Check the game itself, the green knight is also showing 94% on website but in game it is 96%.
The internal help file on the new game is showing 96.27%.

Bushido X-Ways is the same.

At least its in the right thread.

Maybe another error Not sure PnG can be blamed this time.

At least they are still high but kind of off-putting.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

The mouseover RTP at 21Casino is best used for 'guidance purposes only' IMO, it's clearly some sort of manual process for them to put the numbers in and isn't linked to the actual game in any way. Loading the game in and checking the help file is the only way to be sure

 

[Mouse75]

Ive noticed this... but TBF their customer service is a bit scatty at the moment anyway.
If they want to underadvertise and sell themselves short - thats their problem

 

[bamberfishcake]

Looks like there is no smoke without fire.

Lower than default RTP last night at 21Casino across a few slots, including this shocker, which seems to have gone under the radar...

Hacksaw Gaming's new release Stack 'Em displayed at 92.20%!

Found at VS the same.

Im hoping its a typo Nevertheless, many more at 21Casino under default values but surprisingly, Playn' GO seem ok.

 

[hhhelllo]

Yeah right another typo.......

 

[colinsunderland]

Won't be a typo if it's in the help file.
@jacksparks

 

[Mouse75]

They also seem to have dropped Quickspin games completely.

Used to be a good site - now distinctly average

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Yes can confirm all of the above, a whole raft of slots have been dropped to lower maths models at 21Casino, and it seems to me that portfolios from some suppliers have either been dramatically reduced or excised completely.

TBH I'd largely stopped playing there unless they sent me a nice bonus offer as the disconnects and game errors were too much of a pain in the arse, but this is the final nail in the coffin

 

[colinsunderland]

Seems the rep only comments when it's to post good news, these casinos are rapidly going downhill
Also, they are one of the main groups that Chipmonkz is promoting without age gating, don't even have the decency to reply to my PM, so UKGC informed of their inaction.
@jacksparks @Dawn_Branders feel free to comment on here as to why you feel it's ok to allow your affiliate to promote to people without age gating, therefore allowing children to watch? And why you feel he is above the rules?

 

[hhhelllo]

I am worried. I have good trust for some other whitehat casinos like jonny casigo or hellocasino.
@David G Is there any plan to be lowering rtps at your brands? Whitehat casinos were to me synonym of high rtps on every game since forever. 21casino will hurt your brand doing that. If its permitted to them, its all good for all other whitelabels. Its only a question of time since were playing shitty 94% everywhere it seems.
It sucks because jonny is the only trustworthy place offering me 200% with 35x wager.

 

[andym]

Hi All,

To address this, I would like to inform you that this was a change implemented in error by the games supplier. Please note we took all affected games offline whilst the matter was resolved. They will be put back to the highest RTP, tested and released back to live shortly.

Regards,

Jack.

Better luck next time!